How this work where you are?

[Pootnaigle]

heres the scenario.... you are a member in good standing in whatever local union(outside work) and times were booming.During this boom several white ticket hands were sent out on union jobs even though they wernt members. Now the boom has receeded and a few of those white ticket hands are still working on those jobs but several members were laid off on others where work was completed. Suddenly the work has slowed down and there is nothing available out of your local. Do you sign the book and wait for something else to come available or do you bump the working non member? I am particulary interested in how this works in: A. a right to work state and B. in a closed shop state?

[tolex42]

heres the scenario.... you are a member in good standing in whatever local union(outside work) and times were booming.During this boom several white ticket hands were sent out on union jobs even though they wernt members. Now the boom has receeded and a few of those white ticket hands are still working on those jobs but several members were laid off on others where work was completed. Suddenly the work has slowed down and there is nothing available out of your local. Do you sign the book and wait for something else to come available or do you bump the working non member? I am particulary interested in how this works in: A. a right to work state and B. in a closed shop state?


In my local union a white ticket member is someone who recently joined and is on prohibition until he proves himself as a journeyman. There is no bumping He wants to become a member of the union just as you and I did at one time. Probably at that time someone felt there was no place for you in the union either. Many union members feel that they should have been the last person to get into the union and the rolls should have been closed after they became a member. That is just plane wrong.

If this man is bumped he will go back to the nonunion sector and for the rest of his life he will feel and tell people that the union screwed him. Bumping or taking a job from another person always creates hard feelings. If he is a good lineman it is important he be kept in the union and not return to our nonunion competitors. Bide your time, there is a lot of work for lineman now days. You probably will soon get call for another job. The union will be stronger with both of you in it.


The right thing to do would be to walk up to that man, shake his hand and say "welcome to the union".

[TXUNIONWKR]

In Texas white tickets are not union members.

[Pootnaigle]

Ok I guess I need to clarify somewhat> I am not out of work and live in Texas which is a right to work state. And here a white ticket lineman is a non member working thru the local on a union job enjoying union benefits, Paying no dues( however a very small assesment is charged).He has not commited to join and may be working on a white ticket because he isnt sure if he can pass the Journeymans test. The question I am asking is do we let a brother stay out of work or bump this guy? whats your opinion?

[Viperexaf]

I'd say it depends on the situation, if times have gotten tight and there was no work else where then do what you gotta do, still gotta go with what tol posted earlier if he gets bumped back to the private sector then he'll talk about how bad the union did him, believe if it was me then i'd go ahead and have the guy test out and either become a member or in the right to work states then have him moved some where else. I don't know i'm prolly the last person that needs to be commenting on something like this considering i just joined the union. Hopefully someone else has got the better answer.

viper

[wudwoker51]

The use of white paper is BS and should not be allowed, but if I was a member of a local that used white paper I sure as hell know who better be working.

[electric squirrel]

The use of white paper is BS and should not be allowed, but if I was a member of a local that used white paper I sure as hell know who better be working.

Why should some guy who hasn't proven himself get to keep a job when some guy who has gone thru an appreticeship and paid his dues is out of work,even if the white ticket guy is a good guy.If Poots scenario is the case WHAT THE HELL HAVE I BEEN DOING FOR THE LAST 4 YEARS !!!!

I should've drove my ass down south and gotten a linemans ticket and then back home , all in one day!!

Either go to the hall and test out or go to a local jatc and become an apprentice,,,,,,no white tickets!!!!! E.S.:mad:

[42linehand]

I guess it depends where you come from. We have white ticket members who have left the Power Company (IBEW) But that have not yet transferred their tickets over. Our new apprentices our white tickets for one year. If we have someone new joining the IBEW who holds an operators ticket they would be white ticket until they were accepted into the IBEW. Same as a non union lineman he would be white ticket until he passed the journeyman Linemans test at the uniop hall and was accepted into the IBEW. Either way if any were put out to work they would stay working it would not make a difference who was out of work.

[PA BEN]

:o This is a right to work State. Once the Union lets him in can the Hall bump him?

[Goathead]

If your a book one member working in your jurisdiction,and the contractor has a lay offwhite ticket guys would go first.But you would not bump a white ticket employee working for an other contractor.You wouldnt bump a book two employee working for an other contactor as well.Brothers have to understand that the reason for white tickets are to strenghten the union and weaken the rats.It may not seem fair, but the IBEW wants to organize anyone whos taking union work.In the short term it might seem like thier taking your job,but in the long run thiers more work for everyone,without the non-union worker

[west coast hand]

Well said tolex42 you are right 100%. If they leave the union it will make the rats stronger. I come from a strong union state not a lot of rats out here, but there are some good hands that work rat and we need to orginize all we can, and like he said walk up to the man and shake his hand and say welcome to the union.

[PA BEN]

Why would a non-union linemen go union if he has all the benefits of a union job, union membership ie; representation , etc; without actually becoming a union member?

[Genoin NW]

Hey Pa... I've read a lot of your posts, great comments!

I've been a journeyman for the past 30 years and been in union shops for 15 of those years, and 15 in non union shops. I've kept my dues up for all 30 years! I'm proud to be a union member! I was in one shop that turned union during my employment. Every non union shop is a potential union shop... We are all brothers.

[Viperexaf]

Why would a non-union linemen go union if he has all the benefits of a union job, union membership ie; representation , etc; without actually becoming a union member?

Most of the white tickets down here hasn't lasted for very long, been either missin work or doesn't like the rules and regs of the way the union works. The few that have hung around, then crews have been giving them moreless stuff to study so that they're able to go down and take the journeyman's test and hopefully become a yellow ticket. Really all you can do with the white tickets is convince them to turn union, some do, some don't.

[Bull Dog]

Pa I can't believe your serious. It's simple take away the union hands like me and then see were your pay and benefits will be! We fight the fight you get the benefits why not come over and stand up to these greedy companys.

[TXUNIONWKR]

The troubel with white ticket hands in texas is that 99 percent of them dont want to join the union. They just want the job closest to them. When the job is done they will go to the next contractor union or not.

[CHICAGO HAND.]

First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me--
and there was no one left to speak out for me



THAT IS WHY I BELIEVE WE SHOULD ALL ORGANIZE.

[Viperexaf]

The troubel with white ticket hands in texas is that 99 percent of them dont want to join the union. They just want the job closest to them. When the job is done they will go to the next contractor union or not.

i've seen that too tx, but unfortunately i haven't got the right solution on how to solve that problem, that right to work law that is here puts a damper on alot of things that could be done. quite honestly i think they should have a time limit as to how long they can work as a white ticket on a union job, but that's not for me to decide, just my opinion

[PA BEN]

Pa I can't believe your serious. It's simple take away the union hands like me and then see were your pay and benefits will be! We fight the fight you get the benefits why not come over and stand up to these greedy companys.

Hey Bull Dog are you saying I'm not union? Because if you are your dead wrong.:cool: Union all the way;)

[Bull Dog]

Like that Pa sorry you had me confused.

[TXUNIONWKR]

Viper I dont have an answer either. But you can go to most halls here and take your test and get your yellow ticket without being a white ticket first mabey put more presure on them that way.

[Viperexaf]

brother i already got my yellow ticket, wouldn't do any work for the union unless they let me in.

[ZapCzar]

Seems to be a lot of experience on this subject here, I got a question for you. The company I work for just went union TXU which is now ONCOR,:mad: Who in the world picks out these names. Anyway I am a 30 year senior lineman that went thru the 5 years of training. All the test , written, verbal, and demonstrations every 6 months, numerous schools and now that we are union I have to test again to be a journeyman Lineman? :rolleyes: White tickets , yellow tickets good grief I got to make time for one of those union meetings. ;)

[TXUNIONWKR]

Zap dont worry about the test.I know a bunch of TXU hands that are some of the most knowledgable lineman I know. Would like to know if there are going to be more union contractors on property. Especially around Round Rock.

[ZapCzar]

:) Oh I'm not scared of the test just kinda ticks me off that I have to prove I can do a job I have been doing for 30 years. AS far as more union contractors can't tell right now we are in the process of being bought out by KKR Group. I will say that talks with KKR by the union have been very positive so far. That may be the case soon, deal should be done this year.