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Hebrew
03-21-2013, 08:56 PM
I work trouble,we work in pairs.I am 48 and still climb.Had a lights flickering and it stayed with the dispatcher until I got to work.Complaint came in the night before,I started at 2pm.Pole off the road,truck had no access.Shift before me say they were told not to climb,one guy is 58.How do you guy determine when you had enough,do you decide on your own,do you have an age that you stop at that management determines?I do not feel good climbing a pole in the back and a guy on the ground with some clean work boots on.Your thoughts.

reppy007
03-21-2013, 11:49 PM
It sounds like your working with some of the guys Ive worked with....I was going to start a thread on that.....Ill assume we all had to Carry another lineman in the past...could have been cause he was too lazy,out of shape....tired...worried about climbing a rotten pole when it wasnt that bad.....that stuff happens,but Im pretty much safe...in this nice retirement home Ive found:D

bren guzzi
03-27-2013, 02:32 AM
I'm 51 this year. Still climb " if I have to " but the younger guys do most of the spike work. I work the bucket mostly , but to take umbrage with Reppy I ain't being carried, we all have different strengths , I can see problems before they arise ( with 30 plus ) years in the trade. Experience can save the day at times... Ain't much I ain't done in linework .. I mightn't get up the pole as quick, but when im up there I can sometimes be a lot quicker. ( I've learned a few short cuts and can see problems before they arise ).

So I'm not ready to Quit just yet. :D

UGL
03-28-2013, 01:25 AM
The way I see it is this is kinda a management issue. Managers/ suppervison should be pairing younger blood with the seniors. I'm 26 and will not let an older lineman hook if I'm on the job. Most guys in my department have the same mind set.

rob8210
03-29-2013, 07:45 AM
Around here most ( not all) of the young lads are quite content to let the older fellas do every thing for them. Don't get me wrong, we have a couple of really good young lineman, but they are the minority.

bobbo
04-01-2013, 12:35 PM
I worked backlot most of my life due to the heavy crews always got layed off too much. I spent five years every day in my tools for so long that when I was nervous running a pistol grip. I am the same age, 48. But I still school people in working the hooks. What I notice is new journeyman rig.like they are out of the bucket all the time and you can see they dont know how to work with a handline and short rig themselves.to death. You can tell if a lineman works the tools a lot by his hammer. If he has a 24 inch claw hammer, he works the tools. If he has a 3 pound maul, he is a bucket guy. With a long hammer you take off and slide out your rigging. I noticed that over the years. When I work with apprentices in my hooks, I see that they will have those short mauls. After a day with me they buy a claw a next day. Just a heavy ass tool you can do nothing with but drive lags.

reppy007
04-02-2013, 06:59 AM
Hammers..............what if he has a pink handled hammer ....bobbo?:D

CPOPE
04-03-2013, 05:15 AM
You guys make me feel weak or better yet you give me the strength to go on.

I climbed after my first hip replacement a couple of times just for fun. Now

with both hips replaced, a torn rotation cuff left and rights been dislocated.Dented on all four corners old enough
I've got damage in my eyes from sunlight and or flashes. Still don't need glasses though.
My hooks and belt went on eBay November last year.I still carry the tools

Born in 1965 Started aprentiship in 1979 jumped off the tail boards of more trucks up ladders etc, better part of 34 years? Why stop now, I'm just getting good at it, got my journeyman ticket and PE liciance it,s who I am. Can't stop and I won't stop. Always been taught we as a band of brothers don't leave our wounded by the side of the road.

LAMartin.CVEC
04-09-2013, 06:13 PM
This thread kinda went south but it reminded me of some post in the Tricks of the Trade" forum. Mr.Swamprat's (Old Line Dog) posts aren't there any more but Mr. Williamsons' still are.

Enjoy.



get a bigger hammer...

hey sometime ya got to...

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well **** Swimpy... maybe I should paint a picture...

your right us old cats get it...

seen young bucks framing up a pole with a ground one boy had an 8oz ball peen and the other a 3 pound flat faced maul... the boy with the ball peen worked the **** outa himself and only got half the work done... the other kid? work done and busy getting a shovel to clean the auger...

same kids...

one driving a hard head with the toy hammer takes a min and a half and is sweatin... the other a quick tap to set it... 3 or 4 solid hits and he's off to the next gig...

I reckon the "trick" is to get the tools for the job learn them and what they are good for... but most importantly watch how others use them...

you can work the **** outa your self...

or you can get a bigger hammer...

Edge



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ahhh hell Swimpy it prolly was a fuggin 32 oz... still a toy imo... I use a 4 pound double flat face one side for steel and crete waffled on the other for wood...

I reckon there is a point though...

I once told JB that while he has Koga as his Zen master I had my old man...

heres some zen from my old man...

I was working out a turn around... the wire had been sagged and we were laying up the jumpers for clippin on some bundle 230... the old 60 ton had jammed up (was low on fluid)... so me being the young badass that I thought I was at the time... whipped out my hawkbill cut the fuggin hoses and airmailed that ***** from 80 ft or so.... well my foreman flew hot.... cuz it was the only hypress on the job and it was gonna be a day to get new hoses...
I gave him the its a piece of **** line and he gave me the if ya don't like my job you know where the highway is line...

so I gave him the finger and bailed... (another trick of the trade always quit them in a bind boys! that way they know the NEED ya!)

well I got home wife told me they had called wanted me back .... whatever... the old man had called me need a hand doing some **** at his place....

so instead of calling Meyers back I called the old man he was home so I said I'd be there in an hour or so... turn out he had some fence down... needed to get it back up... so I went out to the garage got some gloves a few grips a comealong and then jumped in the old powerwagon and off I went...

got to my old man's he's jabbering about how I should be at work I'm jabbering about how he should be at work... he comes back with I'm management I work when I want to... yada yada...

finally we get the ****ed fence row back up...

and he looks at me as asks point blank..."so why ain't you at work boy?"
so I tell him the story...

he looks at me and says "Boy your my son... and a hell of a good lineman... but your only as good as your tools..."
I say "ohhh really?"
he looked back at me and said "yeah... hand my those sidecutters..." I tossed him my Kliens.
He unrolled some more barbed wire and cut it of then started twisting it around the gate post.
"take that end to the next post and twist it around and cut off whats left"
so I took it over and started twisting it up then asked him for my kliens to cut off the tail..

he promptly threw my sidecutters as far as he could out into the field...

"Pop WTF man thats the only pair of cutters we got!"

he looked at me and grinned...

"Exactly!"

for what it's worth

Edge



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Work Safely,
L. A. Martin
Journeyman
Div III CVEC

LAMartin.CVEC
04-10-2013, 03:59 PM
I've had my knee's, back, right elbow all cut on and just got home 30 mins ago from having my left shoulder operated on (blew it out at work laying up 4/0 to a transformer on a 40c5) I plan on getting back up the stick as soon as they release me.

I will say though after 20+ years it's starting to hurt a little;) however I can't imagine anything better than the view from pole top!

Work safely,

L.A. Martin
Journeyman Div III
CVEC

jerry
04-28-2013, 12:09 AM
I worked until I was almost 65 Years old and still climbed ,didn't expect anyone to carry me.When I started in line work(1965) we climbed everyday and used Hotsticks. I worked the Trouble truck my last 4 years and if it was my trouble call on a backlot I climbed the pole,always called for another Troubleman to grunt for me because I felt it was unsafe to Climb alone especially at night. Some of the younger Linemen would offer to climb for me,but I said no thanks. I told them it was my call and when I can't do the work I am outa here,didn't expect anyone to carry me. Also I agree a 32oz. Ball peen hammer is the best for line work,only type I ever used. Just want to say that I was Blessed to have good health and took pride in being a Journeyman Lineman. Be Safe!

Lineman North Florida
04-28-2013, 09:47 AM
I worked until I was almost 65 Years old and still climbed ,didn't expect anyone to carry me.When I started in line work(1965) we climbed everyday and used Hotsticks. I worked the Trouble truck my last 4 years and if it was my trouble call on a backlot I climbed the pole,always called for another Troubleman to grunt for me because I felt it was unsafe to Climb alone especially at night. Some of the younger Linemen would offer to climb for me,but I said no thanks. I told them it was my call and when I can't do the work I am outa here,didn't expect anyone to carry me. Also I agree a 32oz. Ball peen hammer is the best for line work,only type I ever used. Just want to say that I was Blessed to have good health and took pride in being a Journeyman Lineman. Be Safe!

I was trained by a few men who had that same work ethic as you, I used to have to either hide their hooks or tape them together with a roll of black tape so I could get my tools and make it to the pole before them. I tip my hat to you Jerry, that work ethic is rarely found anymore. Charlie.

reppy007
04-28-2013, 01:24 PM
Ive ran into many ,older and younger ,that dreaded climbing.....I still think....yea,its only a few clamps to be replaced or tightened....you are a lineman aint you?.....It wont take too long....ohh forget it.....Ill get the pole!:D

Pootnaigle
04-28-2013, 06:41 PM
Times have changed but lottsa young guys will sit on their dead behinds n watch a older lineman climb poles all day

reppy007
04-28-2013, 08:08 PM
Its one thing if a guy has a serious or minor situation,a back problem,knees,foot/ect.....but a younger guy that just doesnt want to climb for the sake of not climbing....and (letting) an older guy catch it......is another thing....there was one period where I was sick,off for two months....didnt know if Id ever climb again....well I did....and when I returned every pole was mine,even though my headlineman offered to climb many of times....those babies were mine....what Im saying is that when your away from it for awhile and still healthy....its a privilege to climb,your whole outlook changes....thats the way it was for me anyway.

bobbo
04-28-2013, 10:39 PM
Hammers..............what if he has a pink handled hammer ....bobbo?:D

Ball peen is good if your getting dents out of your Dodge Dart. I have had every hammer, even the three pound maul. I havent put in a lag in a long time. All our braces require bolts. The last time I drove a lag was in worst energy property. Ten foot arms dont have lags. Fiberglass dont have lags. In my bucket have a klein double dinger. But in my belt is the california claw, 2 ft long and 32 ounces. On 2400 or 4800 csps it also works as a finger stick. Also if I dont feel like reaching knocks off my grip or slides it out. If you put on nipple covers on bolts it rips those out. If you bolts too short by one thread, a couple whacks with the claw, it fits. Old wood molding, gone. And if you have to pull old arm with a bent bolt, gone. Also great for gaining. Also slam it in the pole, it holds your belt while you are putting on your hooks. If you are in the bucket and the only place you can go is above the circuit, I can hook a phase and raise it without lowering the bucket. Great for sliding and bringing grapevines.when you land your can before coming off, put the claw behind the washer and bring your bolt all the way in. I have have every hammer. If you drag a three or four pound maul in your belt, you better get a gut strap, because your belt is going to be at your ankles if you dont have an ass.

bobbo
04-28-2013, 10:56 PM
He smokes. Gets crazy. But we climb alot together. We work lot of stuff out that many cant. Its not age. Its attitude. He will be almost 50 years in the trade. And he doesnt want to retire. He loves it. He can climb better than 99% of the journeyman in my lifetime. Very smooth. He does the bottom arms, because we use the handline,to move phases . I take the top arms, because I am tall and its easier for me to layout and move phases. He is the sharpest tack I have seen in this trade. I am not going to leave him anytime soon.

reppy007
04-29-2013, 12:53 AM
If he is still climbing at 64...that is great....meanwhile Im trying to figure out your logo.....california claw and all....finger- stick...ect.

lewy
04-29-2013, 06:54 AM
Ball peen is good if your getting dents out of your Dodge Dart. I have had every hammer, even the three pound maul. I havent put in a lag in a long time. All our braces require bolts. The last time I drove a lag was in worst energy property. Ten foot arms dont have lags. Fiberglass dont have lags. In my bucket have a klein double dinger. But in my belt is the california claw, 2 ft long and 32 ounces. On 2400 or 4800 csps it also works as a finger stick. Also if I dont feel like reaching knocks off my grip or slides it out. If you put on nipple covers on bolts it rips those out. If you bolts too short by one thread, a couple whacks with the claw, it fits. Old wood molding, gone. And if you have to pull old arm with a bent bolt, gone. Also great for gaining. Also slam it in the pole, it holds your belt while you are putting on your hooks. If you are in the bucket and the only place you can go is above the circuit, I can hook a phase and raise it without lowering the bucket. Great for sliding and bringing grapevines.when you land your can before coming off, put the claw behind the washer and bring your bolt all the way in. I have have every hammer. If you drag a three or four pound maul in your belt, you better get a gut strap, because your belt is going to be at your ankles if you dont have an ass.
This is the hammer I use.
http://www.amazon.com/Klein-832-32-Linemans-Straight-Claw-Hammer/dp/B0002RI8XC
As far as having to grab a phase below the bucket I just rotate the jib down and grab the phase, no need to lower the bucket or reach down and grab it.
I think it's great that guys at that age still want to contribute. They have so much to teach the young guys. I just tell the young guys that if you see an older guy working you better be doing something.

bobbo
04-29-2013, 02:20 PM
I destroyed three hammers in 6 mos. Every pole we replaced the wood molding. Fifty years ago whoever pounded the staples in buried them. And a maul is no good for that. I pry a good bit. When we didnt have the internet, I bought the biggest heaviest replacement I could find, the Vaughn California Claw. Milled front, long handle, I havent destroyed it yet. Real heavy and balanced. Great hammer. I had a foreman that loved the wedge grip. And thats all he had. He was brought up sticking. I was brought up with those slide grips. Sometimes thaose wedge grips are like beating off an ampact. Whatever works for you and what situation your in. But I thrive in the backlot or ight of ways where you cant get vehicles. But my tools work for me. So far in the last five I have pole topped rescued a lot of guys who wear all their bucket gear, weighing their belts til they fall to their ankles. I just take my pouch , hammer and an alligator. It works for me.

reppy007
04-29-2013, 03:02 PM
Now its an alligator??????I hate to ask what that is:D.....sounds like you guys strip lots of poles there.....you ever have time to build new lines?.....one company I worked for never stripped the poles out.....that was usually a helpers job with the utility.

reppy007
04-30-2013, 10:46 PM
Back to the older lineman.....through-out the years Ive seen younger lineman try pushing the older more experienced lineman out the door....some of the younger ones had a certain hatered towards a guy that wouldnt retire...Ive always thought it wasnt none of their business when they would retire...why would it be? But Ive seen it,and Im sure others have seen it too.

Patriot
05-04-2013, 10:58 PM
Oldest guy I ever worked around was 63. He was productive until the day he walked out the door. Tough old bird. And really 63 isn't that old, except in line work. Lots of wisdom there, but the faculties are starting to fail. Some are very forgetful, have the shakes, can't or won't climb. Our work force is aging, we were at 51 for an average age a few years back. It is a shame we can't retire at 60.

reppy007
05-05-2013, 01:14 AM
Lets just say that I ran into alot of money Swamp....or it ran into me:D

bobbo
05-05-2013, 07:46 AM
Now its an alligator??????I hate to ask what that is:D.....sounds like you guys strip lots of poles there.....you ever have time to build new lines?.....one company I worked for never stripped the poles out.....that was usually a helpers job with the utility.

Slotted wrench where you dont have to adjust. I found it at a flea market 15 years ago. What I like about it is its old, ugly and no one wants to grab it. When I had crescents, my tools were always the closest, somebody would grab it all the time and it would never find its way back in my belt. That old alligator they just look at it. What os that? I am not touching that. So I always have it.

bobbo
05-10-2013, 06:33 AM
Back to the older lineman.....through-out the years Ive seen younger lineman try pushing the older more experienced lineman out the door....some of the younger ones had a certain hatered towards a guy that wouldnt retire...Ive always thought it wasnt none of their business when they would retire...why would it be? But Ive seen it,and Im sure others have seen it too.

I believe that someday you will answer for all bad deeds. In this trade karma is a *****. Seen it. Some higher power has a checklist, like Santa. Every egotistical a_hole that has treated men badly over the years has had a bad accident, gone to prison, drug addicted or alchoholic, get some crazy cancer where their balls get removed or some kid of intestine-ectomy, divorced and working for their ex wives and kids. And if they are married, these depraved souls will marry some hot stripper then that hot stripper turns into a miserable toothless fat hag. And their misery gets worse and worse. Karma baby!

bobbo
05-17-2013, 09:06 PM
This is the hammer I use.
http://www.amazon.com/Klein-832-32-Linemans-Straight-Claw-Hammer/dp/B0002RI8XC
As far as having to grab a phase below the bucket I just rotate the jib down and grab the phase, no need to lower the bucket or reach down and grab it.
I think it's great that guys at that age still want to contribute. They have so much to teach the young guys. I just tell the young guys that if you see an older guy working you better be doing something.

All we have now our straights. Too many distribution hands used to pulling no.6 copper and number 2 aluminum. The rules change when the heavier the wire. Too many guys are rigging with it and their jibs explode or their buckets turnover. Young guy with a jib and jib line is dangerous!. Be careful most are rated at the most 1500 all the way in, up and down tension.

lewy
05-17-2013, 11:02 PM
All we have now our straights. Too many distribution hands used to pulling no.6 copper and number 2 aluminum. The rules change when the heavier the wire. Too many guys are rigging with it and their jibs explode or their buckets turnover. Young guy with a jib and jib line is dangerous!. Be careful most are rated at the most 1500 all the way in, up and down tension.
If you can lift it the jib can lift it. Our jibs are good for 2000 lbs in the best configuration and 240 lbs in the worst configuration, more than most people can lift off the pole.

rob8210
05-18-2013, 06:23 AM
I have to agree with ya Bobbo. There are quite a few guys out there that don't understand what a jib can and cannot do. I have watched guys try to winch phases back onto a dead end pole from the ground , with complete sidepull on their boom. They just laughed at me when I tried to stop them. I even suggested to take the winch line around the pole! Fully hydraulic jibs are a great tool , you just really have to understand what they can do.

Lineman North Florida
05-18-2013, 08:01 AM
I like jibs and winches and appreciate how much easier that they can make our work, but a lineman would be better off to be brung up working out of a personel carrier bucket with no jib and no winch so he can learn how to do everything with nothing, once he gets to that point and he gets a bucket with a winch and jib it's all gravy.

lewy
05-18-2013, 09:04 AM
A couple of points I agree jibs are not meant for side pulls. The lifting capacity of a jib is not based on how much jib is out, but how far away the centre line it is away from the drum. As far as using MHAD that is all we buy in double buckets, but I feel a young guy should be able to do the work off the pole before he gets in the bucket.

reppy007
05-18-2013, 11:48 PM
When I was coming up,it wasnt unusual to have a foreman pull up on a jobsite....lets say your a two man crew,he would see you pulling a squirt boom up into a yard to get to a pole...and stop everything and tell the head that the young apprentice needs to climb the pole....leaving the truck back on the street........the old hard headed guys wouldnt like the jibs we have today.....some would insist you learn to use blocks and bull-line.....its just the way it was,they didnt like these jobs to be easy.:D

rob8210
05-19-2013, 08:06 AM
The problem I am seeing is a lot of the young fellas are not learning how to rig equipment to get a job done. It would be really good to keep them away from the jibs and winches until they learned to use blocks and pulleys. For example , how many younger guys could set a rear lot pole without a machine of any kind?

Orgnizdlbr
05-19-2013, 11:20 AM
The problem I am seeing is a lot of the young fellas are not learning how to rig equipment to get a job done. It would be really good to keep them away from the jibs and winches until they learned to use blocks and pulleys. For example , how many younger guys could set a rear lot pole without a machine of any kind?

I'm in total agreement! The apes should learn the way we had to, in the tools, then progress from there. The problem where I'm at is the utility wants production, production, production, and training and safety take a back seat!!!

bobbo
05-26-2013, 08:16 AM
I did everything out of hooks for two years before I ever saw a bucket. The lineman was always in the bucket. Built a lot of subt with underbuild. We use to clip and soft side in hooks never in a bucket. Even the foreman would clip in his tools. And the oldest guy would be in the bucket. If there were a five or 6 man crew, the grunt woyld lay out the ties and the connectors for the static or neutral at every pole. And we would compete who could get the most. It was fun. Miss it. Learning to rig with hooks is how you learn. Putting an aprentice in a bucket right off will make another ****ty lineman and we have enough of those.

Brotherskeeper
05-26-2013, 12:22 PM
I cant stand people in this trade who arent lineman deep down. There are a lot of "lineman" in this work because they know and work just enough to get by. They dont go above and beyond. they dont push their selfs. They dont take pride in working 40hrs stright... or take pride in being their brotherskeeper, all they do is belly ache. I work with a couple of guys evertime a pole needs climbed seems like all a sudden they cant be found. I ALWAYS offer and tell my seniors that "i got it" for them. But when i know they are serious and want to work it, I dont push the matter. I say ok, I got the next one then. Funny story.... Im a few steps from being topped out. Was shootn trouble with a young lineman the other night. Had a bad hot tap that had to climb to change out with a shotgun. I was proud of him.. right a way he stepped up and said "i got this ill climb" i told him its all good... ill get it. the pole was shelled out and he is still learning the ins and outs of the shotgun. it needed done quick. after all day, all night, all day, all night fighting storms... we went home to rest. got called back out the next evening to shoot trouble again. same guy running with me. at about 4am got a call ground on service burned from open wire sec. guess what? cant get bucket to it. right a way he steps up. you climbed last "I got this one" he said. this kid is funny cat. he's really laid back, chill and quite as hell. but you can tell when he is nervous because he sings when he's nervous. Lets just say he sang a lot. Lol He did a **** good job and i was proud of him. Its all about taking care of each other. You get this one, I'll get the next.

reppy007
05-26-2013, 08:33 PM
Thats kind of funny....Ive ran into many who sing,some would whistle....had a foreman that would whistle all day long,that got old......knew a guy that couldnt work whenever the foreman showed up........this guy would get a headace the second the foreman drove up:D.........another thing Ive noticed is guys that are good lineman.....go to other places,other areas,other contractors.....lay really low until they get used to the new places and people.

lineman1234
12-13-2018, 10:52 AM
I work trouble,we work in pairs.I am 48 and still climb.Had a lights flickering and it stayed with the dispatcher until I got to work.Complaint came in the night before,I started at 2pm.Pole off the road,truck had no access.Shift before me say they were told not to climb,one guy is 58.How do you guy determine when you had enough,do you decide on your own,do you have an age that you stop at that management determines?I do not feel good climbing a pole in the back and a guy on the ground with some clean work boots on.Your thoughts.



I quit 2 years ago at age 53 with 32 yrears in the bucket and on the pole and urd. I don't have kids or a wife. so its easy for one person. Sock money away and when the calculator sais you can quit you can
Big companys don't know what to do with a person that isn't hungry for overtime anymore.
I shot trouble alone for 8 years. It got so bad because they just kept dumping more and more on one person. I couldn't climb alone but ANY job one would say needs 2 people would be checked out to make sure.
Its a long story the day I quit,, but its a great one. If anyone wants to hear just send me a note

I do think about finding small jobs to keep the skills up.