2 part Q

[reppy007]

I guess this one is more for the utility guys...anyway here we go.Lets say a thunderstorm has hit your area with high winds....you may or may not have these trouble orders on your computer,some might still do it the old way.Ok,your sent on your first order that is located in a subdivision and it turns out to be a blown linefuse....You close it in and get the lights back on.....as you are leaving to go to the next order which isnt in that subdivision,you notice that there are several more laterals with fuses that are blown......does your company allow you to work on those or do you have to go to the next trouble call thats not located there?............Q #2....Utility foreman usually wont get directly involved in the hands on work although Ive seen some instances where they will.Whats your policy on that and as a lineman how hard would it be for you to be on a jobsite as a foreman doing basically nothing but watching?

[Lineman North Florida]

If we were down to working on laterals I would notify dispatch that we had laterals opened up where I am currently working and see if it wouldn't be a better idea for us to go ahead and get them on rather than go elsewhere, unless there was a feeder out, then of course we would go on and leave the laterals out. Working foreman everywhere I have been, don't see how anyone could stand around and watch everybody else work and not hit a lick at a snake.

[Old Line Dog]

If we were down to working on laterals I would notify dispatch that we had laterals opened up where I am currently working and see if it wouldn't be a better idea for us to go ahead and get them on rather than go elsewhere, unless there was a feeder out, then of course we would go on and leave the laterals out. Working foreman everywhere I have been, don't see how anyone could stand around and watch everybody else work and not hit a lick at a snake.

Thank you making it not necessary to post my friend.
EXACTLY. Magnificantly spoken.

[T-Man]

Good answer LNF,

In big storms where whole substations are out, we set crews at that station and patrol feeders clear one at a time and energize the main lines first then work all the taps. We can spend a couple days doing that in real big ice storms.
In question 2 we would call as LNF said and let the control center know what we find and they would most cases, tell the crew to patrol each tap clear then close in. If we found another crew putting up wire or trimming trees we would either help them or if they were good, then tag the fuse tap with an information tag letting anyone else know there is a crew working that tap ( as if it were hot in all PPE and rubber goods-all storm work is in rubber gloves and sleeves by us) then we would move on to the next tap and start over, keeping the control center informed all the way.
Once all the primary is pretty much energized there will be service drops to repair, we cut the bad damaged ones in the clear during the first patrols then come back and put them up to the house at least, then refer the customer to a contractor to repair the service pipe or whatever needs to be done. The contractor may or may not connect the wire at the weather head, then we come back and make it permanent at a better time.

[Pootnaigle]

i guess this one is more for the utility guys...anyway here we go.lets say a thunderstorm has hit your area with high winds....you may or may not have these trouble orders on your computer,some might still do it the old way.ok,your sent on your first order that is located in a subdivision and it turns out to be a blown linefuse....you close it in and get the lights back on.....as you are leaving to go to the next order which isnt in that subdivision,you notice that there are several more laterals with fuses that are blown......does your company allow you to work on those or do you have to go to the next trouble call thats not located there?............q #2....utility foreman usually wont get directly involved in the hands on work although ive seen some instances where they will.whats your policy on that and as a lineman how hard would it be for you to be on a jobsite as a foreman doing basically nothing but watching?
uumm utility foreman= workin foremen

[reppy007]

uumm utility foreman= workin foremen

Not here my friend.....unless the lineman are out on strike.

[Old Line Dog]

Not here my friend.....unless the lineman are out on strike.

Just one of Many reasons....I "Dislike" union.
It's a "Catch 22" ain't it!!:p

At least Poot has....

"uumm utility foreman= workin foremen"

Emphasis on WORKING!!

[Orgnizdlbr]

No working foremen here ...... And you wouldn't want em working. Many came from "clerks and jerks" and have never done line work no less been remotely close to an energized wire.

That's just the nature of the beast up here, it's few and far between where the company promotes an experienced qualified guy to run crews, seems they'd rather have someone they can bully rather than someone who knows WTF is going on.

when the SHT fan they get out of our way and let the lineman take over.....

if on an order like Reppy says and you find associated problems you notify dispatch and then take care of the problem. Although in many cases they pull us off and don't allow us to work the other problems........stupid way to put people back in power, but what do I know!

[reppy007]

I can say that we have some pretty sharp foreman here,Im not going to say all of them but I will say most of them.Its never been that way were they work,mostly supervise.....some have creases in their shirts and jeans,looks good to the public.We happen to have some really sharp meter foreman that are in charge of crews......use to not be that way.....Ive seen them make better decisions than regular foreman.....to this day ....personally I just cant see having a foreman with no what so ever experience in linework being a foreman......but thats just me.

[Rob]

Here it's pretty much the same as LNF said... We have Working Foremen. And they work. Some even still go up in the air!

[reppy007]

Here it's pretty much the same as LNF said... We have Working Foremen. And they work. Some even still go up in the air!

So let me get this straight....for my sake....you and LNF work for a utility and have working foreman.....its just that its unheard of here.....usually its the contractors that have the working foreman.I think its great that you folks do.

[Rob]

Yes Reppy.... We also have contractors working on our property. These crews also have working foreman.

[urban1095]

I guess this one is more for the utility guys...anyway here we go.Lets say a thunderstorm has hit your area with high winds....you may or may not have these trouble orders on your computer,some might still do it the old way.Ok,your sent on your first order that is located in a subdivision and it turns out to be a blown linefuse....You close it in and get the lights back on.....as you are leaving to go to the next order which isnt in that subdivision,you notice that there are several more laterals with fuses that are blown......does your company allow you to work on those or do you have to go to the next trouble call thats not located there?............Q #2....Utility foreman usually wont get directly involved in the hands on work although Ive seen some instances where they will.Whats your policy on that and as a lineman how hard would it be for you to be on a jobsite as a foreman doing basically nothing but watching?

The foreman here are workin foreman.
We have supervisors that make their way to the job every week or so. Most are old line hands.
Everybody does work on are jobsites! And it is a Union shop.

[reppy007]

Do not be confused with the union or non union issue Ive been with contractors that are union and have working foreman.....its really the large utilities....do most of them have working foreman?You would think with a shortage of lineman that they would be working foreman.......I mean everything else has canged.

[Pootnaigle]

Umm utility foremen hafta take an honary with drawrawel

[T-Man]

They call them Lead Linemen and Lead URD installers now by us. The old crew foreman went out 20 -25 years ago maybe longer. They have more responsibility and less time in the saddle in my opinion. It's hard for the leads to notice and correct for differences and details on the job that the Foreman was doing back in the day, while the crew did the work.

[reppy007]

Let me ask this.....can I get a good answer when I ask how the hell can a foreman fairly evaluate a lineman when he doesnt know much if anything about linework himself........ok .....lets make it as simple as we can.......Wheres the logic?

[thrasher]

Reppy, if T-man has same set-up we have it isn't a case of the Leads don't have the knowledge to evaluate someone, it's they are working themselves and so often don't have the time to stand back and watch guys as close as they would if they weren't working themselves.

[rob8210]

Most of the places I have worked that have a foreman on the job , he is a working foreman. Although there are some exceptions, the odd one will not get out of the truck and most of those guys we don't even want near the job. Some of the bigger utilities have crew leaders, and the foreman are more planners. There is no difference here between union and non union. Some foreman will throw their hooks on and come help!

[Orgnizdlbr]

Let me ask this.....can I get a good answer when I ask how the hell can a foreman fairly evaluate a lineman when he doesnt know much if anything about linework himself........ok .....lets make it as simple as we can.......Wheres the logic?


No no effen way some of the foremen we have can evaluate a REAL lineman. They come out to jobs and look for siht to write up like not enough cones out, signs not far enough, enough "words" on the pre job briefing, that sort of thing. When you don't know line work you gotta justify your job some other way......

I'm very close to retirement, I have 41 years in this trade and I love the job. The changes I've seen over the last 12 to 15 years have ruined the trade. I'm gonna miss the trade when I go, but the BS we put up with is making retirement real attractive. It's really a shame what has happened to the trade. And sadly, where I work, the company could care less about the customer.

[Orgnizdlbr]

Reppy, in your part 2 question, are you talkin working foreman or supervisors??? We have a "chief" lineman position that runs the crew, union job, is that what your asking?

[Lineman North Florida]

No no effen way some of the foremen we have can evaluate a REAL lineman. They come out to jobs and look for siht to write up like not enough cones out, signs not far enough, enough "words" on the pre job briefing, that sort of thing. When you don't know line work you gotta justify your job some other way......

I'm very close to retirement, I have 41 years in this trade and I love the job. The changes I've seen over the last 12 to 15 years have ruined the trade. I'm gonna miss the trade when I go, but the BS we put up with is making retirement real attractive. It's really a shame what has happened to the trade. And sadly, where I work, the company could care less about the customer.Labor when we were in NJ last year one of the guys that was supposed to be running the show-up for the company that we were working for told us he better not see us installing any grounds on lines we were working on, my guys were whipped out and all upset about it, I told them not to worry about it cause when we got to the job if we needed to install grounds we would be installing grounds that we were not changing our safe work practices and if they didn't like it they could send us home and we would find someone else to work for. I had a few more conversations with the guy and did a lot of listening while he blew smoke, one of my guys asked me what he had to say and I told him he had said enough for me to know he had never done a days worth of linework, so I saw first hand what you were talking about with guys being in charge and not knowing a thing, it aint just at your company.

[Orgnizdlbr]

Charlie, you were on PS territory, they have they're share of know nothings too.

I'd have done exactly what you did, no pencil pusher would tell me not to hang grounds if they were necessary.... No way I'm exposing my guys to BS like that ever, and in storm damage of that magnitude he had to be a complete moron to make a statement like that.

[reppy007]

Ill be honest lbr....now Im sorta confused cause everybody is calling them 3-4 different names.....lineman use to be called lineman,that changed to line machanics....which I never liked than foreman was changed to crew leader,some people call the head of the crews leadlineman and some call them headlineman,both are the same.Now Im hearing that theres such a thing as a chief lineman......I know were on the same page but using different names.......now I also know that we all can agree that anyone who says he had better not see any grounds on a line is a world class idiot.....na,that aint quite right.....IDIOT is THE WORD.