opening a non load break cutout.

[Bart214]

How many amps of current before its not safe to open a non loadbreak cutout?

[Pootnaigle]

Umm Ive seed 15amps draw an arc the entire amount of travel for the fuse barrel its best to judge the wind before ya do it tho that arc will blow all over the place with a slight breeze

[Hebrew]

Load buster,no worries

[Rob]

The rule here is 25 amps. More than that you have to de energize

[reppy007]

The problem with opening a cutout with high amperage is the damage it might cause,in my case it had been dry for quite awhile.I never actually got it opened,I told another big lineman to open it and he couldnt,so I got frustrated and tried again with a swift pull.Doing this broke a piece of a 3 pronged miff arm and things went haywire,phase to phase to ground....it started the grass on fire and now we were playing fireman....the fire on the ground was spreading really fast and if the customer wouldnt have had a garden hose we would have been screwed.Another thing that you might want to think about is time,,,,,cause the arc/fire can cause other equipment to burn up.....usually the bond wire or the switch itself.So if you like more work open them like I DID :mad:

[reppy007]

Theres a story behind the grass fire we or I started.....it was a type of non-loadbreak switch we call an elephant ear switch,cause the top actually looks like elephant ears.....well this happened in November when the grass was yellowish or brown....dry....the customer on the other side was gone when this happened,matter of fact the customer where the pole was located was gone too,maybe at work.This was a triple terminal pole type of pole....3 risers....Well when the customer behind the pole got home they thought that their teenage son had been smoking in the backyard starting the fire.They must have asked other neighbors cause somehow they found out that their lights had been out......The company admitted that we caused the grass fire and the customer was ok with that....even though the company offered to replace the grass.....Well the next day the customer changed her mind and settled for 800 dollars....but....it wasnt for her grass.......she was smart enough to realize that Christmas was one month away....and the money would come in handy :D

[reppy007]

The rule here is 25 amps. More than that you have to de energize

Explain a little....never heard of a rule on opening or closing....I mention closing cause Ive seen many miss and that will cause an arc....Are you saying if the fuse is stinciled 25 amps or above you de-energize?.....A 25 amp fuse may not have 25 amps behind it depending on the time of day....so do you guys actually amp before opening a fuse or what?

[rob8210]

What voltage? It used to be a rule of thumb here, 15amps, now its use a loadbreak if you can. That being said, I have operated many switches on 4kv that did not have any attachments for a loadbreak tool. Another question, what kind of switch?

[Orgnizdlbr]

The rule here is to use a load buster on all cutouts. Most of our cutouts can be operated with the load buster. On old closed,type porcelain, rule here is to de-energize before opening.

[reppy007]

I have a simple question for you guys.....has this loadbuster rule been in affect for years and if so,for about how long?We used them back in the 80s for a short period of time,and if I remember right it was mostly used on E-fuses....you would hang it on the arcing horn above the switch......any photos...and how many types are used.Here they were just another thing that we didnt use much and they stayed in the service centers bull-pen.Im guessing that they are a piece of standard equipment on all trucks at some places....but not here!

[Hebrew]

I have been with my company 26 years and they have been standard on all trucks from the time I started.I have been to other places and operated the load break cutouts but they are not used in my neck of the woods at all.Load buster use is mandatory.

[reppy007]

The rule here is to use a load buster on all cutouts. Most of our cutouts can be operated with the load buster. On old closed,type porcelain, rule here is to de-energize before opening.

So Mr.lbr.....on all cutouts.....you mean linefuses or transformer fuses too?......lets say you have a 25 kva overhead....feeding 1 house.....you would still use it? Or say its feeding 4 homes....surely not on all?

[Orgnizdlbr]

So Mr.lbr.....on all cutouts.....you mean linefuses or transformer fuses too?......lets say you have a 25 kva overhead....feeding 1 house.....you would still use it? Or say its feeding 4 homes....surely not on all?

Here ya go Rep......

http://www.sandc.com/products/switching-overhead-distribution/loadbuster-tool.asp

yes, the rule here is every energized cutout is opened with a load buster. That's transformers, tie boxes, branch fuses, disconnects etc, etc.... I broke in in 1972, load busters were on every truck then.......

[reppy007]

Here ya go Rep......

http://www.sandc.com/products/switching-overhead-distribution/loadbuster-tool.asp

yes, the rule here is every energized cutout is opened with a load buster. That's transformers, tie boxes, branch fuses, disconnects etc, etc.... I broke in in 1972, load busters were on every truck then.......

Thanks,thats the same type we used....then didnt use....so all those years you guys used them.....amazing .

[rob8210]

Most places I have worked, except a couple of contractors, have the loadbust tools available. We still use it on a case by case basis. Always on underground, usually when breaking parallel, sometimes on cutouts when a transformer is loaded up. If there is any doubt about loading we use it , or load check it first.

[US & CA Tramp]

Just open it nice and slow so you can measure the arc!! :)

[T-Man]

Just open it nice and slow so you can measure the arc!! :)

There ya go just like the old days. . . .if it's a yellow arc your dropping load, and if it's bright blue it's not load. If it's 2400 volts wave your cap thu it to break the arc. Where the heck was OSHA back then? Guess that's why Safety is written in Blood!

[lewy]

I have never used one on a transformer, only on riser or run off depending on conditions. We have amp probes on all of our trucks, if breaking parallel between different feeders depending on the primary voltage, but for us most times that we have a parallel that involves switching with a cutout it is a distribution parallel and we first have to make a trunk parallel so no issue opening the cutout without load bust, or dropping more than 15 amps on a radial runoff I will use one.

[Lineman North Florida]

We have used S&C loadbusters for years on all 600 amp switches, even when breaking a tie and not shedding any load just for the imbalance difference between the two feeders, we are also supposed to use them on any lateral or any underground riser that we open and if I'm not mistaken 50 kva pots and above, it doesn't happen all the time on the pots as we have a lot of rear lot lines with zero truck access, but excellent pogo stick access.:D

[barehander]

Unless you have cutouts with horns, a loadbust tools will not work.6020

[bobbo]

Voltage, load, where it is. . . A grasshopper switch for a 10kva. What's the amp read? What kind of structure? I have seen this a lot in the northeast where solid blades are in for taps and risers. When you were taught all your life solids are for making and breaking parallel. And someone's with no thought or understanding put a solid blade at a tap, because there are enough fused cut outs down the line or internal in the padmount I guess. I guess the first question you ask yourself , does this solid belong here? Or this cutout with no go horns or whatever belong here? Amp read it? If your near heavy retail area with 1000 amps on it? Call someone. If it's a bayonet, does it have a plastic snuffer at the bottom? Is it 4kv? Sad to say rules don't fit every situation. If you are a utility guy and unsure you have every avenue to find the info. If you are a construction lineman, you patrol, check everything, you measure, and make every decision with your info and experience. I have seen a lot of bad things happen when it looked really good on a piece of paper.

[reppy007]

Was that one thousand amps?:D

[Lineman North Florida]

Unless you have cutouts with horns, a loadbust tools will not work.6020 That's a given.

[barehander]

That's a given.
Sometimes on here, don't always know if it's a given.

[Lineman North Florida]

Sometimes on here, don't always know if it's a given.

I follow you.