I think there is a balancing point in safety.

[bobbo]

In our area we have large contractors and small contractors. The better lineman work for the small contractors.

The he small contractors have a lot common sense with safety. The management and the owners are all seasoned lineman and they get the tools and material to complete work. The workers can just worry about completing the job.

then there is the big contractor or utility hovering over men with safety audits, your flags are never where are needed and never enough cones. Your chock blocks are the most essential thing on the job. And your lime vest is mandatory in a bean field.

why are the big multi national contractors will have all the accidents? Because no decent lineman wants the bullshat! The drug addled job scared less skilled hands will work for them. Instead of asking for the proper tool or equipment to do the job safely. They don't want to make waves, they have do more with less. Eventually something happens. Because there heads are filled with all the dumb stuff, that isn't necessary to do the job safely. Their heads are filled with chock blocks cones and rubber trees. And anxious at every sight of a white supervisors truck from their companies or the utilities, screaming where's your chock blocks!! They are having all the accidents! Because every bodies head is filled with dumb stuff and not the necessary.

thats my belief. And I see it's proving true.

[US & CA Tramp]

I agree with you. What you just described is the big companies playing cover their ARSSSSS. All done with the help of a college graduate in "SAFETY" that doesn't know what else to look at, and they feel like big stuff to write you up. I used to like free climbing a pole!!

[Pootnaigle]

Umm in the corporate werld safety is a catch all for do anything at all programs much like national security is in american politics . If You spin it that way absolutely no one can buck it

[bluestreak]

The fact that most of the large utilities are no longer run by people with electrical backgrounds more often than not they are bookkeepers that happen to work in the utilities field. Deregulation has pushed these people to the top of what used to be a service oriented business into a for profit at any cost business like walmart and that type of business CEO is just looking at quick profit so they can get a quick boost in their compensation because most of them come with five year contracts so they don't care about the long term consequences of their decisions. The safety attitude of these carpetbagging CEOs like stated above is CYA and make it so nothing can be traced to them and by loading their workforce with layer upon layer of rules and regulations they hobble their workers from providing the service they are supposed to and then they turn around and say that the workers cost to much.

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

These companies need to start asking themselves how much money has a safety man or safety deparent ever made for them. Zero dollars. Then ask how much the line crews have made for them. Safety departments have turned into safety police. They're more interested in turning guys in to justify their job than correcting a safety issue in the field. I have no use for our safety department and I will shut down our work when they show up and won't start until they leave.

[Old Line Dog]

These companies need to start asking themselves how much money has a safety man or safety deparent ever made for them. Zero dollars. Then ask how much the line crews have made for them. Safety departments have turned into safety police. They're more interested in turning guys in to justify their job than correcting a safety issue in the field. I have no use for our safety department and I will shut down our work when they show up and won't start until they leave.

Good for you man. Really. However...this "safety" thing, is about like this "racial" thing. You say or, talk differently, about either topic. Your butt is toast man. GOOD on YOU!! "Hay boys! Time for a break. Ya'll come on down for a bit..." Heh, heh, heh.....

[trigger]

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q112/phloydsphotos/cowboyafterosha.jpg

[duckhunter]

You all seem to forget who is one of the biggest players at the table when OSHA write new standards. While cone numbers seem trivial, that is just the type of information attorneys can look up to see if something is not compliant. Unfortunately it's not just Safety to deal with, it's also "loss control", just a fact.

[Old Line Dog]

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q112/phloydsphotos/cowboyafterosha.jpg REALLY SAD part about that picture is...I saw that, and was passing it around back in the early 90's. AND...It's gotten 10 times worse since then...in Actuality. It's even startin to mess up the unions, that created all this "hyper" safety bull siht in the first place. Put me, in the "fcuk it" club. I survived OSHA, and retired. Matter of fact...O**** is what helped me decide to retire. With Fond memories of...The "linetrade" I was raised in.

[duckhunter]

Has a safety man saved a company money? The answer is Hell Yes if a accident happened, there was a lawsuit, and that safety man hade made sure guys are following rules. When OSHA shows up on a jobsite and there are violations, the guys don't get the fines from OSHA, the company does. If the company disciplines a man for those violations the union files a grievance. At our place you don't have to follow any of the rules, unless you want to work here.

[bobbo]

If I go to a yard and their nicknames are Sparky, Firecracker and Hand Grenade and they need a truckload of rubber to survive I will pass on that company! If you have skilled, thoughtful good people, they don't need bat**** crazy safety nazis hounding them. And why do you need lawyers? If you have good hands, good leadership, good equipment, there should be no worries about lawsuits? Why should the government cause paranoia and scare? And why do companies cause paranoia and scare? Maybe the men need a little more input and the outcome would be so much more pleasant. Do you pay employees to have a voice in safety meetings, to give you a sense of reality and truth? It would be enlightening wouldn't it. If your company is a dictatorship, you better keep you resume current, it won't last very long. I have been in long enough, see companies real big and a few years of dictatorship they are scratching for hands and losing work. The world changes quick. That's life. Once the bull****, harassment and scare tactics get too much to handle the good hands leave, then you have the leftovers. And then you need a bunch of lawyers.

[bobbo]

Has a safety man saved a company money? The answer is Hell Yes if a accident happened, there was a lawsuit, and that safety man hade made sure guys are following rules. When OSHA shows up on a jobsite and there are violations, the guys don't get the fines from OSHA, the company does. If the company disciplines a man for those violations the union files a grievance. At our place you don't have to follow any of the rules, unless you want to work here.

If you make a guy put rubber gloves and sleeves clearing up phone for a set or a stub pole? Do you make a use the buck squeeze for pole stepped poles? Pole stepped poles are considered ladders, and that's ladder safety? Do you make a guy put a piece of rubber on a piece of triplex? Do you make your guys where rubber gloves and sleeves when load is opened, all sources are opened and grounds in place? Do you make your guys where rubber gloves and sleeves soft siding triplex, and the other end is on the ground and the source not plugged in! If so, why? It's not right to treat people like they are stupid when they earn the money! And they watch tree trimmers clearing up wire in t shirts and leathers? Do your foreman know how to patrol or follow circuits? Because you have to now because the bird dogs are meter readers or gas people. Rules don't make people safe, knowledge does in this industry. And companies need to work on training, because rules are cheap!

[duckhunter]

If you make a guy put rubber gloves and sleeves clearing up phone for a set or a stub pole? No Do you make a use the buck squeeze for pole stepped poles? No, we don't have poles with steps. Pole stepped poles are considered ladders, and that's ladder safety? Do you make a guy put a piece of rubber on a piece of triplex? It depends, not normaly. Do you make your guys where rubber gloves and sleeves when load is opened, all sources are opened and grounds in place? No Do you make your guys where rubber gloves and sleeves soft siding triplex, and the other end is on the ground and the source not plugged in! No familiar with what "soft-siding" is. If secondary is energized we require gloves, not sleeves. If so, why? It's not right to treat people like they are stupid when they earn the money! And they watch tree trimmers clearing up wire in t shirts and leathers? Do your foreman know how to patrol or follow circuits? Yes. Because you have to now because the bird dogs are meter readers or gas people. Our meter readers know how to read circuit maps and follow them too.Rules don't make people safe, knowledge does in this industry. And companies need to work on training, because rules are cheap! Rules are not cheap, they are written in someone's blood. They are there because we still have idiots that don't test and ground, that don't cover up.

[bobbo]

Rules are not cheap, they are written in someone's blood. They are there because we still have idiots that don't test and ground, that don't cover up.
Missing basic steps: cover, where's source where's load, patrolling, functions of re closer, how it works, how to read circuit maps: that's training. Because most utilities send out the office janitor to be your bird dog. The yards where no accidents happen is the ones where there is comradery, good knowledge and no turnover. And I don't the players in the industry are creating those environments. What you call rules we call training.

[reppy007]

Missing basic steps: cover, where's source where's load, patrolling, functions of re closer, how it works, how to read circuit maps: that's training. Because most utilities send out the office janitor to be your bird dog. The yards where no accidents happen is the ones where there is comradery, good knowledge and no turnover. And I don't the players in the industry are creating those environments. What you call rules we call training.

Thats a great one....Most utilities send out the office janitor to be your bird dog:D:D.Might as well from what Im seeing happening to the trade.:nightmare:

[duckhunter]

Missing basic steps: cover, where's source where's load, patrolling, functions of re closer, how it works, how to read circuit maps: that's training. Because most utilities send out the office janitor to be your bird dog. The yards where no accidents happen is the ones where there is comradery, good knowledge and no turnover. And I don't the players in the industry are creating those environments. What you call rules we call training.

I'm not sure what you said here, could you say it in a way an old lineman can understand?

[reppy007]

I'm not sure what you said here, could you say it in a way an old lineman can understand?

Im 54.do you consider that old? If so make me understand too .That training bit has me confused.All these years I thought I knew what training was and what safety rules were,but times have changed and what they do now ,we would have laughed at .

[Lineman North Florida]

If you make a guy put rubber gloves and sleeves clearing up phone for a set or a stub pole? Do you make a use the buck squeeze for pole stepped poles? Pole stepped poles are considered ladders, and that's ladder safety? Do you make a guy put a piece of rubber on a piece of triplex? Do you make your guys where rubber gloves and sleeves when load is opened, all sources are opened and grounds in place? Do you make your guys where rubber gloves and sleeves soft siding triplex, and the other end is on the ground and the source not plugged in! If so, why? It's not right to treat people like they are stupid when they earn the money! And they watch tree trimmers clearing up wire in t shirts and leathers? Do your foreman know how to patrol or follow circuits? Because you have to now because the bird dogs are meter readers or gas people. Rules don't make people safe, knowledge does in this industry. And companies need to work on training, because rules are cheap!
Bingo,I am hearing what you are saying.

[reppy007]

Bingo,I am hearing what you are saying.

Only thing missing is putting crime scene tape around the traffic cones,so that cars will stay away from the cones,but what will be around the tape?