Some Lessons for Contractors

[Co-opman]

I worked for contractors 10 years and I've worked at the co-op for 11 years now. Being on the other side of the fence now, I see some things most contractors didn't and/or don't understand that end up causing us a great deal of headaches sometimes. The reason being that they're gone in a few months and we end up fixing the problems later (usually middle of the night) after they are long gone. You can't blame this on non-union. I worked for union contractors myself, and we have union and non-union contractors both on our property at times and the results are the same. Let's not be too hard on these contractors (since they end up getting our crap sometimes), but let's start a discussion on some things that may help these guys get it right the first time by bringing up some things that have you saying, "Stupid Contractors!!!" Contractor linemen, please take this constructively - many co-op and power company linemen will thank you (when they are able to stay asleep in the middle of the night).
Merry Christmas (that's right - not "Happy Holidays") to all you hard working linemen.
P.S. Let's please not start a fight between contractors and power co's / co-ops. You can start another thread if you want to do that.

[thrasher]

I have lost count of the number of compressions put on with either the wrong die or not enough crimps. Which means that on the next hot or really cold day you have a line burn down or jumper burn off. I don't know whether this is a speed thing, not having the right tools, or just no one ever showed them the right way. (P.S. this is true with both Union and Non-Union)

[RWD]

I used to give a pre-construction meeting. All foremen and lead linemen of the contractor had to attend. In the meeting we went over the correct way to intall connectors and sleeves as well as safety issues we would be looking for. In our contract I as the inspector had the authority to shut down the job and restrict a lineman from the project.

It worked.

RWD

[ColoradoLinehand]

I am taking this as constructively as possible but have to say I have seen Company hands do shoddy work as well as leave a trap for someone not on their toes. It works both ways and to say it doesn't is short sighted and closed minded.

Chris

[Co-opman]

Hey Colorado, I agree I may have come across a little self-righteous. Not my intentions. I am not saying in any way that contractor hands are inferior. The best hands I ever worked with were in the contractor world. Here's the only difference: When an in-house guy screws up, even if it is two years later when problems arise, between paper trails and computers and word of mouth, the guys have a way of finding out exactly who was there. At that point, it's just a decision between wringing his neck and/or embarrassing him in front of everybody - making sure he knows not to let that happen again. Thus limiting the continual on-going of his shoddy work practices to some extent. When a contractor screws up, he likely never finds out what happened, continuing his practices at the next location he goes. We learn from our mistakes, but if you never find out you made a mistake...

[old lineman]

Heres a few things I think will help as I have seen them in play.
PRIMARY CONTRACTOR---means the utility who hires on a contractor.

1.Before anyone sets foot on the job the contractor submits the names of their employees and their credentials. No one can join the team unless they are presented in the same fashion to the primary utility. Evaluate the contractors worker familiarity with rescue methods, first aid (CPR) certificates, etc.
This will prevent them from bringing in unqualified workers from working there if monitored.

2. All of their trucks have to be inspected for faults that the primary contractor deems necessary for their own fleet. Once the job begins, no new trucks can be brought in until inspected by the primary utility mechanics or an approved facility.
Looking for road worthyness, dielectric tests, stability certificates (contractors would often re-chassis a boom) onto a newer truck and never bother to re-cert for stability (1.5 to 1) at 5 degrees, required first aid, fire extinguisher,rubber testing, rescue equipment and so on.

3.The whole crew should have a briefing about company policy and rules.
Nothing ticks off the locals more that having a culture of following a litney of rules and seeing a contractors breaking every rule in the book. That goes from traffic control, to ratty trucks, to rubber gloves, to clothing and so on.

4. The contractor should have to sign onto a performance standard with a termination clause. They should be told up front that the primary utility will visit the work sites unannounced and evaluate the quality and work methods. Non-compliance by the contractor will be corrected at their expense.
Do it right the first time!

5. Either with hold 10% of the total value for one year after completion of the job, which will be paid plus interest once the primary utility is satisfied or set up a bonus fund for reliability to be paid after a certain period of no faults in their work. Perhaps 2-3% of the value.
Just a few ideas.
The Old Lineman

[Viperexaf]

That sounds like a pretty good idea old lineman. It's just too bad here though if it's not the bosses idea then they don't wanna do it majority of the time.

[loodvig]

I too have worked both sides here. I met some real linemen and some boobs. I learned some good tricks or shortcuts from most. Contractors seem to be in more of a rush probably because time is money. So in the rush you will get more of 'you can't see it from my house' thinking.
At national greed all contractors are watched by a FCC. Field Contractor Cord. To make sure specs are followed.

[CenterPointEX]

I spent twenty years as a trouble shooter... In all those years I have aquired intimate forensic understanding of what went wrong... I have now been working on the outside three years... On this side of the fence the guys just don't have any idea about how connections weather over five or ten years... Nor do they care... Especially here in HOuston... The Contractors have the work so low balled that it is all about production... If you don't make quota, you get to load up yer drag bag and take trips to remote parts of the planet where they have another big job going.
...Like one of the things I saw over and over again... When making elbows on URD transformers folks dip the threads of the probe into the silacone to make it easier to screw in. It ain't too much of a problem in the first year or so, but at some point the silacone drys up, and turns into a hard powder that insulates the probe from the wire... This is a slow process, eventually the probe burns off and melts down the elbow and sometimes the bushing, thus the transformer in the process. But if you are under pressure to make up seven to ten transformers a day to keep your job... well you don't have the time to jack with sticky threads on the probes all day... so you do what you gotta do. When I was out in California I called this to the attention of a fella who used to work for Southern Cal Edison. He looked me square in the eye N said, "I know... I used to be a troubleman"... Then with a mischevious grin he added, "Job Security" as he dipped the other probe deep into the dirt engrained silacone ouzing from the side of the elbow ... In California the power comanys calls out contractors at night and on weekends to change out xfmrs etc.
....Not brushing the wire before makeing a connection is another one... I could go on for hours about what went wrong and how to prevent it... But just what would be the Point in that? When I worked for the power company I thought like Co op man... I was a troubleman on nights, and many a cold rainy night I cursed the contractors... to the point I had a severe disdain for them... When I worked for HL&P, I built stuff so as to last the duration of my career... no matter how long it took... Contractors don't have that luxery of time... Some of the things I see getting left out there I don't like... But shutting down the job and or backtracking is not an option cause ya see, I am in Rome now... and ya know what they say about when you are in Rome?...
.........The other day as I was hanging a cutout... I looked down N saw a six foot tall oak tree in the place where a man trying hang the barrel would have to stand if'n I left the switch where it was... N I thought... should I move the switch to a postion where the tree would never affect it? "Grin"
..... The suits don't give a dam if'n or not your work lasts thirty years... All they care about is todays budget and tomorrows market price of the stock... The battle cry of the sixties generation...

[ColoradoLinehand]

Just out of curiousity, how do the Co and Coop hands know which jobs were done by contractors and which were done by Co hands? Here in Denver there is no way that I know of (short of the papertrail) to find out. I worked faults for quite a few years and found that a tool we all call a click clack (which was a standard tool issued by the utility to its crews) were responsible for the connector failing. The tool didn't give a uniform crimp as a BG gun does if adjusted and used properly.

I think where the confusion lies here is the difference between tramps and contractors (not picking on tramps)! A tramp can roll in do a shoddy job get shit canned and roll out. Most of us contractors are locals, just changing trucks, so there is a high chance WE could be the ones going out and fixing the shoddy work of ANYONE.

Be safe, work safe,
C

[Co-opman]

We don't have 2 million customers here. It's not too hard to figure out who did what jobs when you only have 15,000 meters turning. Not only do you see who is doing the rebuilds (or whatever), but if there is any doubt, just ask the operations assistant. She'll look it up and let you know. Our contractors only do big jobs, so it's not that hard to find the work orders. Basically, we don't have time to do anything but new services and the other things that come up like bridge jobs,etc.

[Bear_Boomer]

you'all could learn!

[CenterPointEX]

I think where the confusion lies here is the difference between tramps and contractors (not picking on tramps)! A tramp can roll in do a shoddy job get shit canned and roll out. Most of us contractors are locals, just changing trucks, so there is a high chance WE could be the ones going out and fixing the shoddy work of ANYONE....C
.....Given the oppertunity Union hands will do a union job... Those not doing so get policed by their union brothers. Non Union contactors are a hodge podge of quality. A non union contracor can under bid a job. Go out on the street and pick up desperate labor, then force march them. Working under such conditions eventually causes quality problems. Those hands have no recourse but to aquies or get on down the line. There are nonunion contractors out there who police their own greed and take care of their employees... But they are few and far between.
........Bottem line is, the companys get what they pay for... If the companies pay the contractors for time and equipment then the guys for the most part do a union job... Hard money is a differant story... Pretty much in the case of hard money, profit margin dictates the timetable in which a job must be completed, and thus the quality of the job.
....If ten umpa lumpas produce a hundred candy bars a day, they got time to moniter the quality, if'n suddenly the same ten Umpas have to produce a thousand, then the quality can no longer be monitered... I have worked under both conditions. A power company hand is judged by the quality of his work... A contract hand is judged on production... That is why deregulation to the industry was not a good thing. Regulated utilties judged by the P.U.C. were held accountable for the quality of their system. Out from under the watchful eye of the Public Utilities Commission, the companies are now held accountable only to greed...
... We as union hands have to beware of bowing to Greed. We sell quality, that quality is made possible because we have bargined for decent working conditons at a decent wage... if we don't produce quality, we will lose our bargining power. So when the situation warrents, we must stand togather when Greed comes calling and telling us to bow or be crucified... At that point the brothers have a choice of cowering in fear and watching, or standing in unison and letting greed know that this man will not be crucified alone...
Where Company Hands Used To Take A Sense Of Ownership In The System That Has Been Replaced With A F--- It Attitude. Amen & Amen

[CHICAGO HAND.]

Quality And Pride Are Four Letter Words To The Corporate Nazi's.
Where Company Hands Used To Take A Sense Of Ownership In The System That Has Been Replaced With A F--- It Attitude.

[Co-opman]

Another Friday night in the country at home on call while the wife and kids go Christmas shopping, so here we go...(and I love this job!!!???)

Take a good look at the world and what do ya see? ............ A bunch of crooked poles (and you thought I was going to get deep - let's keep it light!).
By the way, most of these crooked poles had linemen with the best intentions of setting a plumb pole and just sure that it would probably stay that way.
Please don't set poles plumb (at least in Ohio type soil) in these conditions:
1. Unguyed angle (even if set in stone)
2. Line is vulnerable to strong west winds in open country (especially large conductors)
3. Service drops or secondary that have considerable strain
4. Long slack spans (I'm looking out my window right now at a 556 slack span where the pole is leaning about 3 to 4 feet! Drives me crazy!)
5. Any other kind of tensions that the pole will possibly experience

Please take just a minute to figure out what this poles tendency is going to be after it rains and the fresh backfill becomes a vulnerable mixture of muck and anything else that may be in there (your tamp job can only be as successful as the moisture levels and clay and topsoil and rock levels allow it to be. Pretty difficult to obtain).

Please rake and key these poles to levels that will hopefully leave the pole fairly plumb after a few months instead of plumb as long as the weather stays dry and then "...uh-oh, what happened to that pole? I thought we set it plumb?" You did.

I know, you guys don't get paid or have time to think like that, right? In my opinion, that's what linework is all about. Look at the job. Look at all the factors involved. Analyze the issues that could become problems. Plan the work. Work the plan.

By the way, contractors have doubled their prices in Ohio within one year (union and non-union) due to all the FEMA work, so you probably do have the time. I hope that they are compensating you guys with some hefty contracts, because if not, they are pocketing some serious profits.

I sure hope I don't sound like I think I know everthing. I'm just trying to be a little helpful. We should ALL be learning something everyday. I always like to look at the work I did in the past and see what it looks like 2 or 3 years later. What could I have done better? By the way, a lot of linemen that work at not for profit co-ops still very much have a sense of ownership of the system. The co-ops have always been run lean, so deregulation didn't affect them near as much as the IOU's (Investor Owned Utilities). As long as crooked or annoying managers and board members don't get involved, the co-op principles seem to work pretty well.

I sure hope nobody hits a pole tonight. :eek:

[igloo64]

Im outside and wouldn't ever in my life work for a power company . My crews do twice as much work with better craftmanship as the company pukes. My crew has ALL NEW equipment and tools and safety gear and use it religously. I sleep good at night because I know that my work is done the best it could be. So take that and shove it up your ass and always look over your shoulder because I'm coming to take your work away!

[CenterPointEX]

Co ops had the option of opting out of deregulation.. \
...My crews do twice as much work with better craftmanship as the company pukes...I'm coming to take your work away!....The order in which Igloo framed the sentance about his work is tell tale of his breed. Quanity then Quality... If something goes a little awry on a sqease etc. backtracking cuts into profit... so ya weigh the outcome... If I go back an redo it, we lose money... If I don't no one will even know something is wrong for five to ten years... hmmm I got my boys colledge tuition comming up... F--- it!

[500 KVA]

Igloo is a rat f-ing puke too! He lives in a fantasy world like a young child does. Ask a 5 year old and he'll say he is the best at everything in the World. Nothing different than any Rat would say.

You think Utility linemen work 8 hours a day? You haven't a clue what these guys have to do. They are 24/7. And they do it day in day out.

Some construction companies do Utility work for various reasons.

They don't have the equipment or the budget to purchase it. They are indeed held back by stupid budget restraints that let the company hire contractors, but will not let the guys buy needed equipment to do a job.

They don't have the manpower to do a particular job, and cannot be expected to complete a job within a certain time frame, that has a deadline. Why? Because they have to pull off jobs to keep the lights on for their customers. They indeed have other responsibilities within their community.

I'm so tired of hearing how you contractors do this and that, and Utility hands do nothing. I've been on both sides of the fence. I've spent a decade on both sides. You are wrong believeing that.

There may be circumstances you are unaware of that dictate certain things. But normally you cannot begin to think that an employee would not be fired for the things you are claiming happens on a daily basis. No moron can expect people to believe that!

Well maybe you can Uglyoo.

[old horseman]

First let me say this is a touchy subject for most contract lineman. Every contract lineman I have had the pleasure to work with and for has shown nothing but professioalism. I find that most problems between utility lineman and contractors occur because the utility guys have seen the manpower reduced in their barns. They tend to blame the contractors because we seem to taking over their work. The contract lineman view the the utility lineman with disdain because we get busted for silly shit it seems. Wheel chocks. If a contractor forgets to chock his truck and a utility man see's it he tells the bird dog who tells the GF who jumps our ass. But it doesn't work both ways. If we see a crew taking a shortcut and report it it only goes so far and nothing is said to the crew. (protecting thier own).
From what I've seen a little human kindness could solve most of the tension between the crews. Take care of our own (LINEMAN). When you drive by another crew and observe something such as a minor safety infraction (Wheel Chocks) instead of trying to burn the other guy stop and chat for a second and make causal mention of your observation.
Every time we build a structrue, we do little things that not on the spec sheets, with the trouble shooter in mind. Examples: shoes with the nuts pointed down and the pins facing in, cutouts turned toward the pole, hot line clamps that can be taken off from one set up if possible. Sometimes the bird dogs make us do things that we normally wouldn't do.
Remember contractors don't get paid for rain days or snow days. If we don't work we don't get paid. Durring new construction contractors are held to company spec's if a'int right we get to do it again. I would ventrue that most of things you guys are mentioning happen durring storm work.
Maybe I'm in left field here but how about this. Upper Management doesn't want their crews on friendly terms with contractor crews because God forbid we ever present a United Front. Just a little food for thought.
Merry Christmas to all and to all be safe

[Orgnizdlbr1289]

Im outside and wouldn't ever in my life work for a power company . My crews do twice as much work with better craftmanship as the company pukes. My crew has ALL NEW equipment and tools and safety gear and use it religously. I sleep good at night because I know that my work is done the best it could be. So take that and shove it up your ass and always look over your shoulder because I'm coming to take your work away!


Very interesting comment igloo...1547 has both Utility and Outside jurisdiction. I have a suggestion, next Union meeting, under new business, make the same statement to your Utility brothers, see what they have to say about it. If I recall, Gary Brooks was the B/M there in Anchorage, I wonder what he would think of your statement...belittleing your brothers and sisters on a public forum so outsiders could view...read your IBEW Constitution you puke, you should be brought up on charges.

Oh, BTW, you have no idea, no clue what you are talking about!

[Bear_Boomer]

Is this not a productive thread? Let's promote a little harmony here, and talk. The way I see it, is you are all right! Let's work towards a safe and sane environment and stop the bashing. After all, I work for the "rate paying" customer, not the power co., or the contractors, THE RATE PAYING, pay my wages! Bear

[igloo64]

Just what I thought all of you would say. Job scared. Merry Christmas ! Back stabbing at its finest !

[CenterPointEX]

...Just curious igloo, what Local has jurisdiction over your territory? Are any of the hands in you coop Union? I know most coops here in Texas are not Unionized... Coops tend to have a tainted view of reality since they are not really a bussiness, but rather they are part of a municipal entity... Thus they are held more accountable to politicions and voters, than they are to boards of directors and stock holders...
....In effect no one complains about the dollars being spent on American Soldiers... and quite to the contrary the public gets their drawers in a wad when enough is not being spent on them...
... We cain't blame Igloo for the point of view from which he makes his statements... I understand him in that I once viewed the world from his prospective... As a troubleman with company on nights I could not even conceive why contrators did some of the things they did... Working on this side of the fence I understand it more that I want to... As a power company puke, I watched the contract contingent grow steadily larger around me, I feared that they would one day take my job... My fear was not unwarrented... Igloo is right, the company pukes arse belongs to the man 24\7... They don't get dick drug like contract hands do, but the price they pay for a paycheck is not with out sufferage. I used to watch from the dock as the contract crews drug in the gate dirty an worn & park their junk trucks on the corner of the lot... thankful I wasn't one of them...Both sides of the fence have their achillies heel... I don't like dragging in dirty an worn & parking my junk in the corner... neither do I miss the 24/7 ball and chain... .
........Complain as I do, there is no line of work I would rather be in... I thank the God who made me for letting me be part of a trade that lets me work outdoors in his creation, earning a decent wage in the process... Power company pukes have a little compassion on us dirt bags... Dirt bags, know that their lofty perch up on the dock ain't all it's cracked up to be...
.... Uninted we could stand tall... Divided we will have no choice but to bow to the man...

[woody]

Hey co-op man, good thread "some lessons for contractors" ; but please no war of words etc. Yup good show, despite all this I must agree; although somewhat reluctantly with centerpointex. OUR WAGES DEPEND ON OUR QUALITY OF WORK PERIOD. If your a union worker who collects a collective bargained wage, you have a responsibility to uphold your end...PERIOD. Failure to do so will effect your wages or worse your job down the road! Any asshat can come out and say whatever they want ie. GF, supervisor, etc.; but if the job isn't done to spec or standard who really get's the blame? Do it right...do it safe...plan the work...work the plan...etc. show the apprentices the right way because it's not only their future it's are's also. woody

[igloo64]

I wasnt going to come clean about my thread but I have to .On Friday, we came to work and the G.F. got us all together to tell us all the power company hands were filing a grieveance against us because WE WERE TAKING AWAY THEIR WORK. I thought that there was work enough for everyone.We show up on utility property and talk to the power company every day . They all seemed pretty cool guys until this happened. Their management said we did terrific work and they were happy with us. I have worked both sides and prefer to be outside. At least MY OUTSIDE BROTHERS wont stick me in the back. Local 266 is filing a grieveance against local 769 for taking away their work. So there you guys these are the facts! And a note to a couple of you know it alls like 500kva Im union to the core and could give a shit about your response and ORGNIZDLBR1287 bring charges up on me ? For what ? Stating my opionion? Get your facts straight you idiot.

[Orgnizdlbr1289]

I wasnt going to come clean about my thread but I have to .On Friday, we came to work and the G.F. got us all together to tell us all the power company hands were filing a grieveance against us because WE WERE TAKING AWAY THEIR WORK. I thought that there was work enough for everyone.We show up on utility property and talk to the power company every day . They all seemed pretty cool guys until this happened. Their management said we did terrific work and they were happy with us. I have worked both sides and prefer to be outside. At least MY OUTSIDE BROTHERS wont stick me in the back. Local 266 is filing a grieveance against local 769 for taking away their work. So there you guys these are the facts! And a note to a couple of you know it alls like 500kva Im union to the core and could give a shit about your response and ORGNIZDLBR1287 bring charges up on me ? For what ? Stating my opionion? Get your facts straight you idiot.


First of all, you better read THE CONSTITUTION...or can you read? Second, your problem is that the in house guys filed a grievance against YOU. Are you a party to the CBA between the company and the Utility Union? No you are not, so how is a grievance filed against you? Get your facts straight. Now, if the company is violating the CBA as it pertains to certain provisions in the CBA, it is the duty of the Union to grieve the violation. If you were Union to the core you would know that. The telling statement in your post is that management said you did terrific work. I'm sure you did, but management loves to play in house guys against contractors...figure it out, if you can. The management guy strokes you, tells you what nice work you have done. Then blames your Union brothers for a grievance that by law they have to file...management got you hook line and sinker..ever hear of Duty of Fair Representation? I suggest you look it up before you run your mouth.

[CenterPointEX]

Cum now OGB12... your percetpions might easierly be ingested sans all the name calling, however well deserved... or not... I know, I know,... neither am I a saint in that department...

[Orgnizdlbr1289]

Cum now OGB12... your percetpions might easierly be ingested sans all the name calling, however well deserved... or not... I know, I know,... neither am I a saint in that department...

You are 100% right CPX, I dont take kindly to being called an idiot by someone who, frankly, has no clue. I apologise....Ive been in this business for over 30 years. Worked hand in hand with the outside brothers insuring both parties were equally represented and protected. I stand by my statement in the previous post....but I didnt need to belittle anyone or lower the conversation to the lowest common denominator. As you can see, I cleaned it up....but some condesention still remains...I cant help it CPX...I'm too old a cat to be skinned by a kitten.

[500 KVA]

It doesn't bother me to call a stinking rat puke exactly what he is. I'm not above calling him what he is!

You carry a ticket rat puke, but you are no Brother! Anyone can come up with a dues payment. It's how you work, and treat union issues that matters.

Just like the post Org1289 stated. It is the unions duty to protect it's workers covered under their agreement. You are a visitor. You are an invited guest with no manners.

Take it like a man. Do your work, then leave when they tell you to go.

I worked for the money, and the self pride. Not a hand job from the Company monkey.

[lineman641]

This thread started as “some lessons for contractors”, its starting to turn into a union –non union issue .well; it’s no secret how I feel about that so let’s take it to “some lessons or advice to all persons that do line work or u.r.d. construction”. As a 1st year ape I was always taught to keep two things in mind when building or repairing, always work it like you’re the one who will have to fix it, and build it like it was going to your home. I have seen more than enough work that has been done that they don’t care or don’t know. .if its by the road ,put the switch facing the road where we can get to it, I have seen way to many that face the other way , tx’s and feeder switches, why? On any and all crimp connectors, use the proper size and die, its right there on the box! Use all the space you have on the pole, don’t jam it all up on the top 5-6’ where it makes it impossible to work on ,use all the spacing you can .when you get the construction standards for the job it does not all have to be at the minimum .in the rear of, don’t put 3 risers ,use 1 and put a splice box. Has anyone ever heard of a climbing side? And don’t point the switch to the fenced in yard with two dogs in it…for you u.r.d. guys, put tags on the cable for where they go, in the tx and splice box. Bury all to the proper depth. Make up the cable so you can close the lid of a tx or switch on it without everything all crossed up…I know there is a lot more to share and you guys can help with that but there is one more…how many of you have ever thrown a switch in on a cross-phase?? There seems to be a lot of that down here lately. My company will preach safety out there ass but wouldn’t post check a job to make sure feeder or main line circuits are phased correctly!. So please always check when this is needed or required .it really does suck when it’s you on the end of a 12’ stick or a 6’ shotgun .don‘t just blow it off if you don’t have the right equipment, let some one know or put a tag on it. This line of work is not rocket science, but it take’s common sense and the knowledge to know when you might screw up or kill yourself or someone else…lineman with experience are becoming less and less ,because they retire or are fed up with the bullshit. If you work with one listen and learn……………

[DuFuss]

I do most of the things you guys have said I should. I don't really worry about the poles too much for being plumb when wind will be high. I live in Mississippi so I doubt it's that big of a problem. All angle poles at the place we contract for have guys unless it's a slack span or service. Slack spans aren't run for 400 feet. Service poles I set with rake on the bisect. I do clean the wire if it's a ground. I don't worry to much about primary but it does get cleaned on occasion. We must do a quality job over production even on the non-inspected jobs. This comes from the top man. Some of the co-ops we contract with inspect jobs. If it's not correct we must go back and make it right. Our company time. At some places if they see us committing a safety violation they will suspend the crew. The co-op I contract with will call and warn the foreman if our safety man calls him up asking where we are to surprise us. We have a pretty good relationship with them and they have changed the way I thought of co-op men. I first thought they weren't about jack until we worked beside some on Katrina. The ones from this co-op and one that came to help from Arkansas really kicked butt. Gave me a whole new respect for them.

[Co-opman]

Vertical jumper sleeves on primary:

Different companies differ on preferences, but vertical primary sleeves are trouble waiting to happen. We much prefer the H-taps with a good hydraulic connection that allow the water to run through the connection without trapping it in. If sleeves are used, make sure to squeeze from inside of sleeve to outside (just like directions say) and make sure no-ox filler makes a very good seal on the end. Otherwise, when it gets down toward zero degrees, the water that has gotten inside the sleeve will freeze and cause it to pop off just as if it was never squeezed.

Also, we have had Anderson VC6 tools brought onto our property that sometimes cause problems. At times, the points on the press will puncture through the sleeve allowing water to get into the connection and then it's just a matter of time before it burns off. Most of the problems from this tool just happen from water being able to get inside of the sleeve entering through the ends, though. It doesn't have to freeze to cause problems, but that seems to make them show up more. Other times, the VC6 will be used on sleeves not made for the Anderson tool and it just makes a really poor connection. Most of our problems are on large conductors.

[dirtdobber]

vc6 is a hand held hydraulic press.

[Trampbag]

I realise that all linehands think they are the best damn thing to come down the pike, contractor, ute puke, one county boomer thinking of the second county, and Gods gift to line work. All of you are represented in this thread, me included, probably.

No matter where I have worked, about 5 % of linemen aren’t worth a fig 10% are incompetent, 85 1/2% are good hands and 1/2% are brilliant. Personally I’d like to believe I’m in the high 85%, but…?

Why not stop talking sh*t and say it like it really is, about 99.75% of us do what is necessary and not one bit more on most days, as little as possible on a few days and are on fire once in a while. We can point a finger at others as substandard because it justifies our existence, makes life tolerable.

Fact is, all the finger pointing makes us fell better about our daily drudgery. I’ve seen ute pukes get away with absolute crap work because they are the authority, contractors cut corners and tramps perform brilliantly, once in a while.

Go figure!

[woody]

Trambag...don't know where you've worked...don't really care after the last post. I work union...construction...take great pride on my work...and don't do anything to comprise it ever! Don't give an inch for qualitiy work! EVER! Walk a mile for safety...stand down for safety! ...will do whatever for any reason at any given time for the company! BUT WILL NEVER BACK DOWN ON THE QUAILITY WORK done by JOURNEYMAN LINEMAN! It's all we have too pass onto others! woody

[Trampbag]

:confused: Well, at least now we know who is the God’s Gift to linework.