Interesting question

[dbrown20]

Went to the Union meeting the other night. The BA had an interesting question that came from the Canucks. Question was if you had people in a bucket with a phase on the jib and you had to do a rescue on them how do you do it? He said no one has an answer yet.

They were pushing 2 man crew work once and I asked the safety guru if you see someone in trouble do you call on the radio first or attempt to help them. He thought a second and said call on the radio first. What a bunch of knuckleheads. dbrown20

[mscheuerer]

Db,

Thats a good question. We have been trained and taught that in a situation like that, it's more than likely going to be "case specific" with the rescue to commence based on different variables. (This is discussed during our tail board). We all know time is of the essence in our jobs especially when it comes to a downed or injured brother. Some of those variables may be dependent upon;

Is there another Bucket working the line or nearby?
Are there groundmen/spotter personnel below?
Have the disconnects been located, identified and tagged prior?
How many guy's in the bucket? Are both hurt? What other obstructions exist?
What type of blocking order exists?
What is your emergency plan? Is it implimented?
Is there a remotely operated reclosure nearby?

These again are just some variables that will help provide courses of action to take once they are identified. Our utility generally will insist that the line be de-energized before rescue is made if it poses a threat to other personnel. I assume at some insurance outfit that they don't want another possible exposure to loss of life and/or injury. I know this doesn't sit well with the rest of us (including me) but thats their policy. Do we follow it? Of course we do ;)

Perhaps applying cover-up to the jibbed line or pulling the disco's to de-energize? Contacting disptach to remotely open and hold an identified reclosure? Again, I know...TIME is of the essence! Rescue breathing and/or CPR need to be administered ASAP! Potential isolation is a major factor as well. The decision making process will begin rather rapidly once these variables are identified.

As for your other answer from your safety boss, they always said to us to call first, whether 911 or dispatch in an event of an emergency. This stirred up a ruckus so bad that when we switched over to the digital system they incorporated an emergency button on all radios, portables, truck/handheld etc... Protocol is that when in the event of an emergency, PRESS BUTTON! A pre-programmed emergency "FLASH" message will display on dispatch's terminal identifying truck and crew. An attempt will be made to contact crew (in case of accidental hitting) to verify emergency. If no answer after first try, emergency personnel are dispacthed to the location regardless. So far this has been working. We've had our share of accidental pressings of the orange button and it's nice to instantly hear a voice (within 20 seconds) requesting information. I guess in the coming of age this is the newer technology and we have to live with it.

Hope this helps.

[dbrown20]

This is the first time I have encountered this scenario. As a lineman, my first instinct would be to get them down. Some people, and I agree is to bring the bucket down using the lower controls and to hell with the phase. If it breaks, so be it. Of course the wire size might prevent this. This is an interesting problem and I can't see the practicability of trying to open the disconnects etc. Time is of the essence. My first thought would be to have dispatch kill the line and bring the bucket down if possible. If nothing else climb the nearest pole and cut the phase. What if steel poles though? To me this is just another sympton of problems that occur using smaller crews and modern equipment. This scene will be very rare but I'm sure at some time iit will occur. Safety folks better think and have a plan on this. Interesting though. dbrown20

[Stick-it]

clear the ground (traffic, etc...) cut the phase with hot cutters and save your brother.

[woody]

dbrown20, what will anybody really do if they haven't been trained for any particular scenario? Love the fact that you raised the question to a safety guy... hell hope some of us here ask this question at our next safety meeting or union meeting. Why you ask?... well db brings to the forefront the crux of the question...2...or...3...man crews...and SAFETY! Trick question...Hope somebody doesn't have to answer it in real life. woody

[BigClive]

Some people, and I agree is to bring the bucket down using the lower controls and to hell with the phase. If it breaks, so be it. Of course the wire size might prevent this.

The worst scenario here would be if significant downward pressure was applied before the wire snapped. In that case the bucket would go down much faster than gravity losing it's occupant/s and even if they did stay in the bucket would probably recoil a bit at the bottom and flick up again. Could eject occupants upwards or break legs or ribs if someone was lying over the edge of the bucket.

[the hammer]

Any safety training you take says to call 911 or dispatch first when it's an adult. If you don't call them first that means it's going to take them that much longer to get you the help you need. One example, if your partners heart has stopped you will need a de-fib to get it going again. CPR WON'T start a heart only circulates the blood until a de-fib is available. If you call 911 1st, you may have them there by the time you have your man out of the bucket.

[Koga]

with the hand held radio I keep with me when Im out of the truck.We have the orange buttons on em also.Calling on the radio while Im heading to the truck takes about 3 seconds to get the exact location out so they can get help comming to you. If for some reason the one shot on an upstream device didnt work and I cant get the operater to drop the circut then I would push one phase into another with an extendo stick. Phase to phase will take it out a lot quicker than anything else. Then get em down and do what I have to do.

Koga

[lightningrod]

Our utility has invented a release method to open the wire holder so the bucket can be lowered by bottom controls.
On the jib head release ring we have attached a small snap that has a small insulated rod on it about 18" long laying back along the jib, at the back of this rod is a small nylon rope that goes to the back of the jib and down through the hole at the back of the jib. On the end of the rope is a metal ring about 6" in dia that hangs down below the jib a few inches.
If an accident happens with a phase in the jib you can reach up with an extension stick and trip the jib head release by grabing the metal ring and pulling down, you would be surprised how easy this is to do as we have all practiced this.

But I do have to say this has only been done in practice (thank god), I hope we never have to use it but it does seem as if it should work well. The one thing we are alittle afraid of if there is too big an arc that it may burn the rope off but even that would take a couple of minutes so you should have time to trip it. Also we have to have our extension stick out to be ready while working hot.

[graybeard]

Is anyone laying out a blanket and gloves so if there is a guy on the grnd they can get on the truck?

[dbrown20]

Our utility has invented a release method to open the wire holder so the bucket can be lowered by bottom controls.
On the jib head release ring we have attached a small snap that has a small insulated rod on it about 18" long laying back along the jib, at the back of this rod is a small nylon rope that goes to the back of the jib and down through the hole at the back of the jib. On the end of the rope is a metal ring about 6" in dia that hangs down below the jib a few inches.
If an accident happens with a phase in the jib you can reach up with an extension stick and trip the jib head release by grabing the metal ring and pulling down, you would be surprised how easy this is to do as we have all practiced this.

But I do have to say this has only been done in practice (thank god), I hope we never have to use it but it does seem as if it should work well. The one thing we are alittle afraid of if there is too big an arc that it may burn the rope off but even that would take a couple of minutes so you should have time to trip it. Also we have to have our extension stick out to be ready while working hot.

I don't know. It sound sort of make shift to me. At least it a try to address the problem though. I can just see some excited guy on a windy day trying to stab that ring with the extendo. I think this scenario needs to be thought out a little more thoughly though. If something like this ever happens I would be interested in how the rescue is accompolished. dbrown20

[billfoster67]

OSHA through the 70's to late 80's use to have a nationwide hotline report on all deaths in the field. They were the first ones at the site of an electrocution accident before companies. They did there investigation and put in in a form of a hotline report- cause by poor judgement, bucket truck set up, lack of ppe, mechanical failure like on tensioners... They quit doing by lack of funds. Now they show up maybe 6 mos. later after an accident. They are not really educated in our trade ... they just worry about chock blocks...expiration dates on your real comfortable hard hats and harnesses... Very few are line trained. Once we had company safety guys, the ones missing arms or looked like Freddy Kreugger- that made the mistakes. Now they are retiring and a person with an associates degree in Safety is taking over, baby face 22 year old.

Hopefully OSHA will get back to the way it was. Having experienced linehands getting to the accident first. Not the media, company, and own the scene and make good reports. Then possible good change could happen... I remember I was in a great big burn down. Our GF got rid of a tensioner, we were have problems with, when there was no underbuild. It was sent out to get fixed, we got two months later and they said it was fixed. The our tensioner let loose over underbuild, dropped in the primary on our first pull. A mechanically inclined lineman broke the bull wheels apart and found out the brakes on the tension were rusted up, the calipers were out of adjustment. 6 guys could lost there lives that day.

We pay taxes to have a good OSHA. And have good investigators that should know our trade. I would say OSHA needs to have an open call for lineman who would take care of our trade. Not hard hat police.