Cross Trainning ?

[Koga]

Ok it has been touched on in other post so lets get down to it specificly.

When I started with the Co. in 79 a Lineman was trained and worked everything from 500 KV transmission hot to URD secondarys. Its just what we did and as a grunt and apprentice you where expected to learn it all. The only thing referred to as "cross trainning " was during your apprenticship you did at least a six month stint in the service dept and another in the substation dept. So by the time you topped out at 1st class or journyman you could do and did what ever was needed. You might spend 6 months doin nothing but transmission, live bare hand , hot stickin , next you might be doin nothin but workin OH distribution, in the ally off the baker boards hot or off the pole dead work. Or on a bucket truck in the bucket, if you where a 1st class, if you were an ape get your hooks out and don't even bother to ask unless you wanted an ass chewin. If all you did was go up and get things off the hand line and watch, your ass better be up there. Same on transmission for an ape too. You were taught everyday and always questioned by the lineman and foreman in the field so by the time you did make it to a class room it was actually a break so to speak. Now I see and hear of more and more the " specialty" . Just URD or just Transmission, or just :eek: bucket ????? I realize with all the new computerized URD radar stuff and all the new scada switches and all the new computer relays and reclosures and sectionalizers and on and on....... It can be :confused: But thats my job to learn and know all this and how it all works to keep the lights on. To install it , maintain it , fix it or replace it . So whats the deal ?
Is that where Linework is headin ? To the specailty groups ? I hope not.It will be a damn shame?


Koga
Koga

[OLE' SORE KNEES]

It seems today's lineman have come to that. When going thru my apprenticeship ,we were thrown from distribution to overhead to transmission.The more I talk to those coming up have only done one facet of linework..........I am thankful I came up when I did....I think the best journeyman is well "rounded" not to say there are not good lineman in thier dept. but if you can rig transmission you can shine on distribution with less effort to move wire even if with collar ropes...........

take care ,work safe,still climbin'........Ole' Sore Knees

[electric squirrel]

Ok it has been touched on in other post so lets get down to it specificly.

When I started with the Co. in 79 a Lineman was trained and worked everything from 500 KV transmission hot to URD secondarys. Its just what we did and as a grunt and apprentice you where expected to learn it all. The only thing referred to as "cross trainning " was during your apprenticship you did at least a six month stint in the service dept and another in the substation dept. So by the time you topped out at 1st class or journyman you could do and did what ever was needed. You might spend 6 months doin nothing but transmission, live bare hand , hot stickin , next you might be doin nothin but workin OH distribution, in the ally off the baker boards hot or off the pole dead work. Or on a bucket truck in the bucket, if you where a 1st class, if you were an ape get your hooks out and don't even bother to ask unless you wanted an ass chewin. If all you did was go up and get things off the hand line and watch, your ass better be up there. Same on transmission for an ape too. You were taught everyday and always questioned by the lineman and foreman in the field so by the time you did make it to a class room it was actually a break so to speak. Now I see and hear of more and more the " specialty" . Just URD or just Transmission, or just :eek: bucket ????? I realize with all the new computerized URD radar stuff and all the new scada switches and all the new computer relays and reclosures and sectionalizers and on and on....... It can be :confused: But thats my job to learn and know all this and how it all works to keep the lights on. To install it , maintain it , fix it or replace it . So whats the deal ?
Is that where Linework is headin ? To the specailty groups ? I hope not.It will be a damn shame?


Koga
Koga

Well Mr. Koga can see your point of view,but I think there are still some apes that truely are learning the trade the way they should.Out here in California we do the six month at a step thing.In that six months you might see nothing but U/G or backyards, or you be ass's and elbows in everything.

I was blessed to work with some fine lineman,a couple of guys that were useless but for the most part a good bunch of hands.I was able to do it all except substation.I top out in a couple of days,in the last 3 years I've done pole change outs ,U/G,#2 thru million, a good bit of hotstick'n,12kv thru 69kv,some highline on wood poles,(had new arms flown in to us up on 80' wood poles) Reconductor( I climbed and clipped in six,50's, when the gf drove by and told the foreman to let the one ape in his hooks have a bucket put the rest on the pole)I got to do some deadend work off the ladder on a 230 line and a whole lot of bell change outs.I got to fly on the skid from tower to tower on one job.Worked 4 or 5 snow storms, two firestorms, a whole lot of car hit poles,only turned down 2 or 3 call outs ,went on a ton.Did a crap load of backyards in So Cal.Set around 100 fiberglass poles one time in the mountains.I think I got a pretty rounded apprenticeship,I let my lineman have the bucket everyday,I tool up, unless we gotta glove it.We have a 2nd step ape on the crew too,I try to set the example.I think its an ape's JOB to get on the pole asap,when the primary is tied in you put the tools on.Even if you just go up and watch or help an ape NEEDS to be up the pole,you cant learn anything laid up in the shade on the end of the handline!! Out here in Ca. we have some pretty good apes,I have seen quite a few that fell the same way I do!! E.S.:cool:

[Koga]

have had a pretty well rounded apprenticeship. But my point was alot more now a days I see guys that say they have topped out and can't do overhead distribution or any transmission and vice versa. Now all our transmission work is contracted out so the young bucks comming up wont learn it. I think thats wrong . I've heard the term "cross trainning" and am beginning to see it refer to different aspects of linework like they are all separet specialties.And to me thats a shame. I know there are places where it is common practice and I cant help but think thats not right.

Koga

[Pootnaigle]

I hafta agree witk Koga. I dont beleive that Entergy will ever train another well rounded lineman. They may get lucky and find a few good linemen that trained elsewhere but with thier predisposition to contract everything out ( and to Rats I might add) there will never be a well rounded journeyman that can say he got his expertise from Entergy. Its a shame because they have people that would love to experience every aspect.I would be willing to bet that they couldnt put a crew together to hot stick anything and if they did That crew was Old Gulf States Utilities hands. Them boys done it all Transmission ,distribution, Urd , just didnt matter, any guy was competent for any task.

[west coast hand]

That's why I always say you get the best apprenticship with contractors??? UNION CONTRACTORS THAT IS

[Koga]

You aint wrong, I remember one crew sent in after a hurrican blew through when they saw the first job was in the ally, then they said they were a bucket crew only. No hooks. Nobody climed. What good were they to us at that time ? O, zip, nada, nothing. I think they were sent home. But that was apparentlly the norm where they came from. Poot is correct also, if it was an old GSU crew there would have been hooks out before all the trucks stopped on the road. Just the way it was. And should be. Times are a changin though, and I guess I better get used to it. Damn sure don't seem right though. Hopefully one day the biggest problem I'll have is, which guitar to play !!! Now thats a decision:D

Koga

[JPSURF]

but if you can rig transmission you can shine on distribution with less effort to move wire even if with collar ropes...........

take care ,work safe,still climbin'........Ole' Sore Knees

Will not get into this debate! :confused: I will just say i don't agree and am not going to put any brothers down in this line of work. But they are two different beast for sure!

[Swollen Tongue]

Swamprat is right on this one. Utility I work for is I guess medium sized. Covers about 600 square miles and about 170,000 customers. They always want the latest when it comes to switchgears, SCADA, monitering equipment,etc. Every sub you go into is different. I think I may have been misunderstood in earlier post about URD. The installation and maintenence isn't very complicated but shooting trouble is a different animal. I do it quite often. Isolating trouble in the city network is a damn bitch. Just the switching is about a four page switching seiquence and takes between 6 and 8 hours depending on the time of day and load demands. If there is a lineman that can write that up in the field I'd like to meet him and buy him a beer. It requires constant monitering of load, and peeling load off breakers and putting it on others depending on the time of day. Setting up multiple stations regulators or LTC's. Matching positions on some. Matching voltages on some. neutral for others. All this is determined by our dispatchers. Yes I'm the real deal as a lineman and troubleman. I'm a third generation lineman and been doing it since 1979 and I still don't know enough to do this alone. Yes it has become a specialty trade in some respects,

[scammy]

es are you saying you top out in only 3 years????scammy

[Swollen Tongue]

No Scammy. By third generation lineman I'm talking about my Grandfather was a lineman for TVA, my father was a lineman, and I'm a lineman. Spent 4 1/2 years in SELCAT to become a lineman in late 70's early 80's

[scammy]

no ,,no swollen ,,I was refering to electrice squirrel,,be safe,scammy

[LostArt]

If I'm not mistaken, I think ES might be in that generation pile. 'Could be wrong though because there are many of you that are.

[Swollen Tongue]

Try again. ES???