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australiantroubleman
03-29-2008, 08:16 AM
This may be abit of topic , what qualifications do your control room / despatch people .. (the guys in a office directing switching and troublework) required to have before being promoted into the control side of our industry?

Are they ex troublemen? operators? engineers? technicians? , traditionally our company wanted ex troublemen/operators with our extensive field experience , however these days most of the older field guys are not interested in going into what is really a highly stressful office job and leaving the outdoor workplace.

I personally love working outdoors and would go stir crazy stuck in a office even if it was full of high tech toys to play with.

Is it worth going into a control / despatch job and leaving the field?

graybeard
03-30-2008, 09:16 AM
Those jobs used to be filled from the guys from the field. But just like the safty dept. they can't get field guys to take those jobs so now you get people who don't have a clue. They work a 12 hour shift and all ways seam to be short handed and a fair amount of turnover.

IN THE SHADOWS
03-30-2008, 06:11 PM
This may be abit of topic , what qualifications do your control room / despatch people .. (the guys in a office directing switching and troublework) required to have before being promoted into the control side of our industry?

Are they ex troublemen? operators? engineers? technicians? , traditionally our company wanted ex troublemen/operators with our extensive field experience , however these days most of the older field guys are not interested in going into what is really a highly stressful office job and leaving the outdoor workplace.

I personally love working outdoors and would go stir crazy stuck in a office even if it was full of high tech toys to play with.

Is it worth going into a control / despatch job and leaving the field?


I think it all depends on the individual as far as what interests you. I took one of these jobs about 2 and a half years ago and love it. The utility I work for has upgraded the minimum qualifications over the last few years to requiring a Journeyman level electrical background to get started. Yes the 12 hr shifts can be a drag, however, you get a lot of days off, and that works for me. On the down side , I work in a windowless enviroment, a building surrounded by a prison style 10 foot high fence ( complete with the barbed wire on top) that your every move is documented from the time you "card in" the gate till you "card out". All phone calls, radio conversations, keystrokes on the computer are recorded. etc etc.
I think though that I was attracted by the gadgetry. Sitten in front of 12 flatscreens operating a transmission and distribution system (maybe in a strange way) is kinda fun to me. Can be extremely stressfull and extremely boring and back again within minutes. Overall I would have to say though that at my age...this job will probebly get me on out to retirement just fine. The best part though.....as a Journeyman Lineman, I used to hate gettin called out at 1-2am in the morning during the storms...now its pay back time!!! ;) :D

linemansmilestones
03-30-2008, 09:15 PM
PG&E , where I retired from, has only qualified operators, that are schooled in todays technology. Operators of the past may have been people from the field, but todays grid is so sophisticated, old school is not working.
I had a great relationship with all the operators. I was their eyes and ears, and they were my connection to maps and computer data, to resolve system trouble shooting. Metropolitan problems get very complicated, and I appreciated their craft and professional skills to help me resolve problems, especially in the underground.

BigClive
03-31-2008, 01:31 PM
I think though that I was attracted by the gadgetry. Sitten in front of 12 flatscreens operating a transmission and distribution system (maybe in a strange way) is kinda fun to me.

Yeah, but you don't actually get to turn stuff on and off randomly for fun. :(

Hebrew
03-31-2008, 03:41 PM
At my company all of our operators used to be linemen except one,the last one!Like most of you guys,none of the people who work outdoors do not want to be stuck inside.You have to be computer literate at least as the software is Windows based(I think).Extensive training is provided for about 3 years.

IN THE SHADOWS
04-01-2008, 08:39 PM
Yeah, but you don't actually get to turn stuff on and off randomly for fun. :(

So true Big Clive...Not quite ready for the unemployment line yet!!:eek:

markwho
04-05-2008, 12:10 AM
We have dispatchers that answer phones and call us in if needed. When any switching is needed we call in an engineer outside normal working hrs. During the day there is always one in the building available to us if needed. sometimes we need to coach them along, and are not afraid to ask questions if we have a doubt about any part of the procedure. I had an engineer tell me to open a bypass switch for a pole mounted recloser and then open the recloser with the tank switch. needless to say i broke the load with the tank switch and then isolated by opening the bypass switch. I don't really recall but i don't think there were any ears on the switch for a loadbuster anyway.

australiantroubleman
04-05-2008, 08:14 PM
Its very interesting to see how different countries and companies run their control / despatch functions , many years ago our company took over a small rural council that ran a "dutyman" system after hours, they switched the company phone to your house you took all company calls .

You had the maps and updated switching positions of all equipment taken home with you , it was your job to call out staff and direct switching from your home , the poor guys wives had to put up with disruptions from ringing phones many times and try to stay polite to the customers in the middle of the night.

They had some kind of primitive by todays standards radio system that was portable and seemed to work ok for most of their areas.

The dutyman job was shared by the troublemen and i bet their wives where not impressed when their turn come around.

The guys where very good in their own area but when some where promoted into our control room they really had problems running a busy and complex urban control room desk and most ended up back on the road.

markwho
04-06-2008, 10:16 AM
Wow, That sucks. My wife isn't happy just when the phone rings when i am on top of the call out list! We are planning a trip to Italy in the fall, so when the phone rings now I just tell her Italy and go to work!

neil macgregor
06-07-2008, 01:30 PM
phoning the control room in NEDL is a twenty minute wait i think they,re all playing cards in there the best one i,ve delt with (in the UK anyway) is hydro board north scotland thye seem to answer the phone right away and i think i,m right and saying they have the biggest over head network in the UK:)

CPOPE
06-08-2008, 02:18 AM
Is it worth going into a control / despatch job and leaving the field?

I thought I would never be able to work in an office enviremont 40/week. Started in the trade back in 79. Came off the truck in 88 fo field engineering. progressed through the ranks so I hardley get out anymore. Been in the office full time near 5-7years. Love it.

If you do try dispatch negioate withe them to maintin your line qualifications through annual training. All dispatch control authorities should have wrench time and maintain line/station qualifications in my opinion.

theweber
06-08-2008, 09:58 AM
I have been thinking about taking an operator job (control room) at my company . If it is the same way at your company? When you take the job your fellow brothers act like you have stuck a knife in there back and union.

linemansmilestones
06-09-2008, 11:03 PM
This may be abit of topic , what qualifications do your control room / despatch people .. (the guys in a office directing switching and troublework) required to have before being promoted into the control side of our industry?

Are they ex troublemen? operators? engineers? technicians? , traditionally our company wanted ex troublemen/operators with our extensive field experience , however these days most of the older field guys are not interested in going into what is really a highly stressful office job and leaving the outdoor workplace.

I personally love working outdoors and would go stir crazy stuck in a office even if it was full of high tech toys to play with.

Is it worth going into a control / despatch job and leaving the field?
Most new operators have no field experinece, since all the work is computerized other than switching in a station. this fact is why troublemen are so important to make hands on decisions in the field. A lot more decisions by t-men, require experience in regards to the system and safety.

linemansmilestones
06-09-2008, 11:13 PM
I have been thinking about taking an operator job (control room) at my company . If it is the same way at your company? When you take the job your fellow brothers act like you have stuck a knife in there back and union.

Any new job has an adjustment period of 3 months to a year. Don't put a lot of feelings into what your brothers think. In the short term lineman think you are leaving them, and the outside crews. the operators group will either accept you with open arms and teach you, or shun you as an outsider, for a period of time. the reality is they will need to depend on you as you assimilate into the crew or team.
think about you and your career number one, and all the rest will fall into place. I know several operators who used to work in the field. Most had an injury. It will be a big change for you, but if you want it, go for it

wormy
06-11-2008, 07:58 AM
I had one of the jobs and I hated it. Lots of days off but still not worth it. I was stuck by myself from 7pm till 7am. Here comes a storm and I was only one to handle 2 states. Lots of stress and a lot of worry for the crews in the field. Worst thing I ever did in my life. I was used to working in the field doing switching on line and substation. Some of the guys and gals had never done any and could not read a one-line. They wonder why they have switching errors and blow stuff up

Trbl639
06-17-2008, 11:17 PM
Our dispatchers are sperated..some work distribution, others transmission........most of the transmission dispatchers are ex-relay techs from the field, or ex transmission lineman or substa maint hands..same on the distribuiton side..ex lineman that got hurt or worn out, and wanted to go inside, or again ex-relay hands.........some of our distribution dispatchers are great.. a few need to go ahead and go to the house!!!!!!!

They will rotate between the distribution side and the SCADA desk, which where a lot of our switching orders come from, for scheduled outages..........for SO's when working trbl, the dispatcher will give ya one......SCADA has a EE there to write up and review all SO's for scheduled outages...pre-arranged stuff.........

But the transmission dispatchers work ONLY transmission!!!!!! so there is no confusin!!!! as far me........I don't think the widowless bldg and long shifts would be my cup of tea.....sometimes they get held over, and there is no Hog Law for them...they are out of the Union!!!!!! but the feds only allow them to work so many hours, in so many days, because of the stress!!!!!!

wtdoor67
06-25-2008, 07:46 PM
How many of you Yankees know what Hog Law is? Funny to me.

Trbl639
06-25-2008, 09:19 PM
How many of you Yankees know what Hog Law is? Funny to me.

Been way too much of Hoggin around here lately:D Seems like every other day or so here.......3 times in 4 days............I'm gettin too old for them all nighters:)

Cheezer
07-06-2008, 10:24 AM
It's interesting to see how different companies do things differently. Even our company does things different from state to state(8 state territory). Where I'm at, the line of progession goes from troubleman to lead troubleman(they do all of the trouble dispatching plus are out in the field half the time), then to sub-station operator, then to distribution control center operator-all union positions. You can stay a troubleman forever if you want, but once you go in to be a lead, you go through the line of progression.

Our transmission operators are non-union and they can hire anybody, but there are a lot of ex-lineman and relay techs sprinkled in with the "civilians." The system works pretty good except when you spend 6-8 years as a lead and operator with out any midnights(except for storm work), and then you go into the control center to finish out your career going back to working crappy midnights!

IN THE SHADOWS
07-07-2008, 07:58 AM
OK......I give.....What the hell is Hog Law?....Got to have something to do with Hoggin OT? :)

wtdoor67
07-07-2008, 10:44 AM
I'm not sure he used the term in the manner that I understand. In open range country all livestock were allowed to run free and graze or range whereever they pleased. You just had to keep up with them and know in what vicinity your livestock were apt to be found. This of course prompted almost 100% ear marking and branding as some folks might take a liking to your cattle, hogs, horses, goats etc.

Anyway cattle and horses could be easily contained by a 3 or 4 wire barb wire fence. Not the same for hogs as they will go pretty much where they please and even with a good hog wire fence you always had to be looking for escapees.

I was raised in an area that had open range for many years. Since hogs roam where ever they please some folks got a hog law enacted. I think it was voted on by town ships. Where ever hog law was enacted that meant you had to keep your hogs penned up or in a hog "proof" fenced area. If your hogs escaped into areas that had hog law then the locals could pen them up and charge you for keeping them etc. until you came and collected them. I never knew anyone where I lived to do that as they just contacted the owner and said that he had some hogs in the vicinity and the hog owner just went and got them.

I don't think that Arkie used the term in the context I understood. Just a piece of useless trivia I guess.

IN THE SHADOWS
07-08-2008, 09:59 AM
That is funny. Thanks for the explaination. Must a been where "hog wire" fencing came to be too, like I got around my pasture. Might keep hogs in but still aint worth a damn for keeping them stupid beef in. Mine still got out now n then.:D (With the fence charger on :eek:)

wtdoor67
07-08-2008, 10:29 AM
Well the style where I was raised was a section of hog wire on the bottom and a couple of strands of barb wire on top. This supposedly contained both cattle, horses and hogs etc. I noticed in Wyoming that what we called hog wire they referred to as sheep fence.

Pootnaigle
07-08-2008, 05:15 PM
Hog Law refers to the 16 hr clause in many contracts.Simply stated the law prohibits working more than 16 consecutive hrs in a 24 hr period. After working the 16 Employees must have 8 hours rest time. So If one does work more than 16 its because he is an overtime hog thus the hog law. Or if one is approaching 16 he can say the hog law is about to get him so he hasta quit fera spell.

IN THE SHADOWS
07-08-2008, 11:21 PM
Hog Law refers to the 16 hr clause in many contracts.Simply stated the law prohibits working more than 16 consecutive hrs in a 24 hr period. After working the 16 Employees must have 8 hours rest time. So If one does work more than 16 its because he is an overtime hog thus the hog law. Or if one is approaching 16 he can say the hog law is about to get him so he hasta quit fera spell.

So is it a Fed OSHA statute or reg, a state wage and hour law or what? I did a quick scan and havnt found anything on it yet.:confused:

We dont have contract language supporting a mandatory 8 hour break after 16 in our contract, (its 24 in a "declared emergency") but the Company has been following the 16 hour practice for the last 4-5 years or so, and the Union has never really bucked it.

We still have a "fatigue clause" that allows an employee to take the next day off without pay if he is too "fatigued" from working all night. Has to work at least 4 hours after midnight or 6 hours any part of it extending past midnight to qualify.

"Hog Law" make sense from a safety standpoint, as long as an employer doesnt force a 16 hour shift. Most everyone has no problem going at least 16 at the start of a storm.

Years ago we used to go 35-40 hours straight at the start of a major storm before taking our first rest period, but everyone is differant. Some can be fatigued to the point of being a safety issue after 8 hours pending on their condition at the time of being called out.

Pootnaigle
07-09-2008, 05:56 PM
Its a contractural thing thats pretty common in the south. Lets say you were called out on sunday evening and worked until early monday, after 16 hrs you would be entitled to a "saftey layoff" and since it coinsided with your regular schedule that time would be paid. and you would return to work monday evening if needed and to possibly do it all over again........
Ive seen guys do this for several days and be paid around the clock.

Doggboi
07-09-2008, 08:46 PM
Its a contractural thing thats pretty common in the south. Lets say you were called out on sunday evening and worked until early monday, after 16 hrs you would be entitled to a "saftey layoff" and since it coinsided with your regular schedule that time would be paid. and you would return to work monday evening if needed and to possibly do it all over again........
Ive seen guys do this for several days and be paid around the clock.

off topic ..

In our shop , on the days we arent scheduled to work we have a 'ghost 8' 8-4 I believe. So once we work 8 after 4pm we go dbl.

If we get our 16 and still out when the following normal work day starts , We are paid a 'rest day' and not required in until the following regularly scheduled work day.

There is more to it , but I would need to get confirmation on it. Also meal allowances involved, or paid time to eat as well.

There is more to it , but I would want to get more facts before I type more in.