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LAMartin.CVEC
05-22-2009, 12:31 PM
I would like to preface this thread by saying that I have been reading posts on this site for several years now and have really come to respect the thoughts and opinions of many of you Journeyman (Mr. Wtdoor67, Mr. John Bellamy, Mr. Edge, Mr. Tramp67 and many others).
With that being said, I would like you ask you guys a few things regarding your company's policy's with being "on call" or "duty".
Currently at CVEC we have a first man and a second man or "helper". We go "on" on Friday morning at 8am and remain "on" until the next Friday at 8am. The first man is responsible for responding to all outages/partials and what not, while the second man is required to do all after hours reconnects and to aid and assist the first man should the need arise (the need to go into the approach zone, downed wire, so on and so forth).
Currently the first man takes the service truck or a bucket home and is able to go directly to what ever call he may receive; the second man takes a meter truck (small pickup) to that he can respond to call outs for after reconnects or come directly out to help the first man if need be.
The rumor going around the shop at the moment is that the company may be getting ready to "take" the trucks from us, and by that I mean that we would have to drive to the shop when ever we got a call to get a truck and then after the trouble is cleared return it to the shop and drive our personal vehicle back home.
Currently we work an 18 and 6 in a 24 hour period. If the rumor becomes fact I see a lot things that will hurt us, the Lineman on call.
Please let me know your thoughts/opinions and feel free to ask me any questions if you feel that I need to clarify or add anymore information.

Be safe and thank you,

L.A. Martin
Journeyman CVEC

BigClive
05-22-2009, 12:44 PM
I'm not sure how it is in America, but here in the UK if we take a company vehicle home we get personally taxed on it for having "personal" use of a works vehicle.

What do you think of THAT!

(Just part of the "f*ck over the workies" culture we have here.)

johnbellamy
05-22-2009, 03:47 PM
[QUOTE=BigClive;62601]I'm not sure how it is in America, but here in the UK if we take a company vehicle home we get personally taxed on it for having "personal" use of a works vehicle.

What do you think of THAT!


Hush.... the men are talkin.


Martin.....


We have one guy on call, wed. to wed. , 1 for 8 weekday's , 2 for 8 on weekend's and holiday's.

They have a service truck to take home, benifits both worker and company, response time is important.

Are you paid for bein on stand-by? Having two guy's as you do is smart in my opinion, you will always at least have a second man.

To me , it's alway's a crap shoot, take this weekend for instance, they have one guy locked in because he is being paid, but other guy's scatter, good luck finding a crew sometimes, but that is there call. But there is some insentive to stay home on holiday's, triple time for call out's 0:00 to 6:00, 2.5 rest of the day, plus the 8 for holiday.

Two hour min. callout, plus a half hour for travel time to shop, so if they take your truck's away, your time should start at home when your called out, but I don't know your contract.

Having your stand by person have the truck with them should save them alot of money, lost revenue caused by feeder lock out's, or tap fuses blown add up, but I don't care how much the company looses in revenue, but I do care about the customer's home with no light's. Make what ya can, and remember you are do them a favor for covering there property.

Boomer gone soft
05-22-2009, 04:14 PM
Service Reps for Alliant don't make "standby", but we do work out of the house and park our trucks there. (The company pays about $62/mo. for plugging them in during the winter months.) Which means, of course, we are on-call 24-7, but we can take ourselves off of the call list by calling an automated number.

mainline
05-22-2009, 04:29 PM
I'm on duty right now. We get payed 10 hrs straight time for a duty week. We get a minimum of 4 hours straight time per call out or however many hours you work at time and a half. Our time starts and stops at home. We can take a pickup or bucket home, but most choose to take a pickup. If you don't mind being chained to the phone it isn't a bad way to pick up some extra money.

wtdoor67
05-22-2009, 05:39 PM
I think I've explained my experience before on this but I'll give it again. When I worked for John's sweet co. our agreement was 1 hr. of straight time pay for ever 8 hrs. stood by or increment thereof. For example if you stood by for just less than 16 hrs. you would get credit for 2 hrs. straight time pay.

Holiday standby was 2 hrs. of straight time pay for ever 8 hrs. etc. All this was of course in addition to the OT you worked. A normal weekend would figure to 8 hrs. straight time pay. A 3 day weekend (holiday weekend) would bring 14 hrs. straight time pay. For the others like Thanksgiving, Xmas etc. I don't remember. Would have to figure it.

The location we worked, everybody lived closeby and no one took a vehicle home. Some did occasionally. If there was a lot of crap going on I just usually left one callout and drove the co. vehicle home. I don't recall they had a rule regarding this.

At that time 2 hrs. was the min. callout and all OT was double. They also had another rule that if you worked past the normal mealtime (6 pm, midnite, 6 am, etc) you received an additional hr. of straight time until being released to eat. The only catch was that you had to ask if they wanted you to keep patroling etc. Dispatch was authorized to do this.

Standby was rotated among the 4 people elgible, foreman, 2 linemen and a serviceman. During the week the manager caught the calls and then called out the low OT man, if possible.

I thought it was an ideal agreement. I recall for several years I grossed about twice my base pay. OT was pretty well divided and you got the gravy along with the crap. Fair enough.

Public Service Co. of Ok. was a shocker to me. The servicemen got all the basic OT, the easy stuff you know. They kept a truck at their residence always and basically were on call 24 seven. No extra compensation was paid for this. Coercion and bullying by management was the method used to make sure anyone was available. I witnessed several arguments between management and service people over availability. I never got over this arrangement and it just always seemed to puzzle the hands when I explained my feelings over this. They were all conditioned to it I thought. The IBEW is pretty sad here I thought. Don't get me started on their seniority. Pitiful, pitiful.

lewy
05-22-2009, 05:54 PM
Do you have a 24 hour emergency shift? The reason I ask is we did not have 1 about 10 years ago & at that time there was 2 guys on call & we both had a truck because they want a quick response time especially for fire calls & wire down calls. Now that we have an emergency shift the on call guys no longer get a truck. If it is just the 2 of you looking after your area I think management would be crazy to not have you both take a truck home. The way we would run it is the first guy would respond to the call & decide if he needed the second man, anything electrical he would always call the second man. We would alternate between first & second on call. We also run on call from wed to wed , easier for long weekends

redrider
05-22-2009, 10:10 PM
I work for a coop in minnesota and we have 2 crews -4 guys on call from monday to monday. 1st crew and 2nd crew. 1st gets all the calls till it gets busy. We have 4 pickups for the guys on call, or you can take the bucket home. Alot of the crews like to meet at the shop just because you get more hours that way. 1 hour each day for standby, 2 hour guaranty for each call. We work 7 to 3:30 straight time, on call until next morning.

tramp67
05-23-2009, 12:20 AM
Every place I've been on call provided a company vehicle to take home, and we were supposed to take it when we ran errands or whatever. The idea was to minimize response time and also gave us access to the company radio. Our time started when we answered the phone, and ran until we made it back home, or a reasonable allowance for travel time if we didn't go straight home. If a second person was needed, they would head to the yard and get whatever rig we requested, along with any material. Liability issues also were a factor, if we were driving our own vehicle on the clock, the company is responsible for any liability. If the on call guy has a piece of sh%t vehicle and gets in a wreck, the company is wide open. Also, customer recognition of vehicles is important, you don't want to respond to a fire or downed line in a personal vehicle. Your company would be making a big mistake by taking the vehicle away from the on-call guy.

Figurehead
05-23-2009, 02:40 AM
We don't take trucks home. When we accept the call our time starts. All call-outs are 2hr. min. double time. Two men voluntarily man standby for call-outs on the weekends. Sometimes it involves alot of back and forth driving. I'm 2 miles, 5 min. from the shop so I don't mind. We've griped amongst ourselves about driving home after long calls being tired and falling asleep at the wheel. Trip home is on our time so we wouldn't be covered by workers comp if injured in an accident.

Tsplice
05-23-2009, 10:45 AM
There are no less than two men on call here 24/7,(wednesday to wednesday)we add at least one more,sometimes two, on long weekends.Each man takes a small buckett truck home,and calls are rotated,so that everyone gets a piece of the o.t.pie.We get 16 hrs standby pay on a regular schedule,and an extra 4 hrs.for a holiday.Two hrs min,call out pay@1.5xreg,rate and dbl.time on Sundays and holidays.After reading some of the postings here over the years,I'm pretty satisfied that we've got a fairly sweet deal!:)

Dbearman
05-24-2009, 05:30 PM
At the Cooperative I work at we are on call Mon. 7:00 am to the next Mon. at 7:00 am. One man is assigned as primary and 2nd man as secondary on a daily basis. Primary lineman takes a company pick up home which is stocked with fuses , extension stick , volt meter . He is the first one to respond to a call out . If a fuse blows or a recloser opens and they will not hold , the secondary lineman is called who is driving a fully stocked one man bucket truck home . Then we have the required 2 men to work voltages over 600 volts. Osha regs allow one man to do routine switching alone which would cover replacing cut-out switch fuses and attempting to close breakers. Weekends we always run together and meet at a convenient location and run together in the bucket truck. Works pretty good unless you are a lot of miles out when a fuse wont hold and then you have to wait for the second guy which seems like forever at 2:00 am! 2 hour minimum for all call outs and 8 hrs of 1.5 pay for being on call work or no work. We get paid OT from the time the phone rings until we get home and clock out with dispatch. Bear

Edge
05-28-2009, 09:22 PM
Martin...

We gotta guy that goes out and does the little shit...if he needs help or we got big storm stuff we call guys in...most of it's on a percentage kinda thing... like a quota I guess...most guys try to get theres and hole up... but you got someguys that are OT whores like me... hell you boys over at cvec should know how we do most of our stuff dominions picked up a few of your boys in the past few years...they keep feeding you guys shit sandwhichs like what you posted and we'll prolly be getting a few more...
hope stuff works out for you guys...

Edge

LAMartin.CVEC
05-29-2009, 09:49 PM
I'm sorry I haven't been able to reply to this thread, I had this past weeks watch.
Thank you all for your candor and quick response. Lineman tend to be far more forthright in matters that affect each other than any other type of people trade,religion or what have you (!) then I have ever known.

Mr. BigClive: I'm not talking so much about have the trucks at home for "personal" use is as much as I'm referring to them for WORK only. I believe that Management and what not that uses vehicles for primary transportation to and from work and various other things are taxed here stateside as well. While I may take a truck home, It is only when I am on call and there fore working--or on "standby" to work. I maynot receive a call but the truck is there for me to respond if so needed.

Mr. Bellamy: We have 4 hours time and 1/2 standby pay we receive that on Sat.,Sun,and holidays. However, if I work 6 hours I get paid my six hours and that's it. If I work 3 hours I get that and my hour of standby. We have no double time or anything else beyond time and 1/2 regardless of hours worked or holidays. As far as a contract? Virginia is a "right to work State" and CVEC is non-union. I know that they tried to organize years ago but it didn't work it was with the Utility workers union; I personally have no idea why they went that route as far as I'm concerned the only union a lineman should be in is the IBEW, but that's a topic for another thread or perhaps a PM. Meanwhile CVEC remains an "at will" employer.

Mr. Boomer: CVEC does not have "service reps" so to speak. we have 3 divisions. In 1 and 2 they usually rotate the first man as the "service man". Here in division 3 we have a service man but he only pulls duty when it's his turn.

Mr. Maineline: what you have time wise sounds similar to what we do. My biggest fear is that whey would want us to "clock" in and out when we get to the shop and leave the shop. This could be a nightmare considering we have to work 18 hours before we can get our 6 hour "rest". I could easily see there being 20-24 hour days with only 15-16 hours "clocked".

Mr. WTdoor67: Some of what you and Mr. Bellamy have described sounds like a fairytale. However, I know it is true. I can only imagine that if those conditions existed then...well then they must be even better now, and that sir is hard to fathom.

Mr. Lewy: No sir we do not have such a thing as an emergency shift, I would however like to hear more about this; please elaborate.

Mr. Redrider: you sound like you have an almost ideal situation,but I prefer 4 10's :)

Mr. Tramp67: You sir have hit the nail on the head as to some of the points we here have. When MY phone rings and they tell me I have a 4a (outage here) and I say I'm on my way: thats My outage START TIME! If I'm responing to an outage then I"M WORKING!

Mr. Figurehead: If we had min 2 at double time and callout was Volunteer, I doubt anyone here would complain about not having a truck to take home. The flip side though is that I also doubt that many would volunteer.

Mr. Tsplice: yessir, that sounds like a sweet deal indeed. I'll just stick to trying to keep the trucks but then again If I shoot for the stars I might hit the moon right?

Mr. DBearman: man it sounds like you guys got it together! I personally would like to see CVEC go toward a system like that!

Mr. Edge: yessir we have lost a few lineman to you guys. The man that left division 3 a few years ago is sorely missed. He was a heck of a guy and a great lineman. We are trying to not be a training ground for you at Dominion or AEP or any other utility around us though.

Thank you again gentlemen. Please feel free to add to or ask for anymore information. Your responses have been quite an eye opener.

Be safe,

LAMartin

Journeyman CVEC

wtdoor67
05-29-2009, 10:42 PM
The agreement I worked under in Wy. started your time when you were called and ended when you returned home. However a max. of 30 minutes reporting was allowed and the same on your return home. Greatest agreement I ever worked under.

Once again contrast with PSO (Okla). When a lineman is called out his time starts when he bumps the dock and ends when he bumps it after the work. Once again the serviceman get the gravy. They start their time when they leave their house in the co. service truck and likewise when they return. Of course with the GPS system they've got you. I think they have GPS's in all vehicles now. What a big brother system. I am so relieved to be gone. I tried a few times to contrast their agreement with a great one, but never seemed to make an impression.

I think people get inured to poor treatment and sort of conditioned. These co's chip away slowly at your benefits until you're not getting shit but don't really realize it. I have seen many people come to an IOU from perhaps an REC, or a Muni. In this part of the country it usually means perhaps a 5 dollar an hour raise. To get a 10 K annual raise so impresses people they think they have hit a gold mine but eventually reality sinks in with some. I have seen this over and over.

If Bellamy's agreement is similar to the one I worked under when I was employed by PP, he just better stay there.

Maybe if EFCA is enacted people will have a better life.

I have mentioned this before but expecting people to work long hours and then cutting them loose when they hit the warehouse has always bugged me. I have mentioned it before but I recall a case in Missouri when an REC guy wrecked and killed himself after working extended hrs. His wife sued and received a large settlement. This was quite a few years ago. I keep expecting this to happen again.

lewy
05-30-2009, 06:53 AM
We have a department & they work 24/7 & there main responsibility is to respond to trouble calls & switching for system , they will also be given some small jobs that they can drop right away. They mainly handle the simple calls ,but anything major they will call in the on call crew. All of our O.T. is double time plus we get standby pay & a minimum call is 3 hours, but that never happens anymore because if you get called in you know you will be working for more than 3 hours. In our old system when we would take a truck home you would use that truck as your personnel vehicle for the week & the clock ran from the time you received the call until you got home.

Stinger
05-30-2009, 07:30 AM
Martin- ask Thraser what Rapahanock co-op does. I believe the on call guys for Dominion out in the country take home a service truck, or at one time did.

Edge
05-30-2009, 10:31 AM
Martin- ask Thraser what Rapahanock co-op does. I believe the on call guys for Dominion out in the country take home a service truck, or at one time did.

yeah Stinger... it still works like that at dominion

rcdallas
05-30-2009, 08:28 PM
At my company on the crew all we get is minimum 3 hr on call outs, no company trucks or anything to take home... the servicemen take their buckets home with them, but with all the GPS junk and things to do with being "ethical" with the company I don't think I'd want a truck to take home.

At the coop I was at, on the service truck you have your own truck you take home everynight, on the weekends you got 16 hours time and half whether you went out or not... when on call you take the truck with anywhere you go... call rotation was every other week.

thrasher
06-02-2009, 10:33 AM
Good guess on where I work; but wrong. I do know a bunch of guys at Rappahanock but I'm further south in the state.
We are Union here, the on call man takes home a service bucket and time runs from leaving the driveway to getting back to the driveway, 3 hour minimum. On-call man also gets 8 hours OT for his call week in addition to what he works. Weeks are assigned at the beginning of the year and lineman's responsibility to find a replacement if he doesn't want to work them.
The second man does not get a truck at home and we call from a rotating list of people, they have to answer at least 30% of calls in a quarter. His time runs from door to door, also a 3 hour minimum.
Barring storms there are lots of weeks where the troubleman won't get more than 1 call in the week.

Pootnaigle
06-02-2009, 06:08 PM
I spoze I have it purdy good. I have a company pickup and if I wanna use it for personal business its kind of an unspoken rule that I pay for the fuel that I use.A call out is rare but not unheard of and the minimum is 4 hrs.I also have a company credit card for fuel and such for company use. There are several fellers that take em to the lake on the weekends routinely and nothing is ever said. But I dont bleve I would use that card 200 miles away from the work place.I'm purdy sure a dressing down would take place and I just hate them.

koca
06-02-2009, 08:20 PM
The first utility I worked for had crews on-call is the city but in the sticks we had two lineman on call a first man out and a second man if you needed help 1hr straight time on weekdays/2hr straight time on weekends and holidays. Drove the companies rigs to and from home, time started at the call and ended when you got home. Time & a half until 16hrs in a 24hr period then double. Double on Sundays & holidays plus your holiday pay. The outfit Im with now has no standby or on-call all calls are double time, time starts at the call & half hour return to home, drive your own rig to and from the shop. Good and bad to both I dont like being tied to the phone or pager but the free ride to and from work was alright and so was the on-call allowance, on the other hand I like the freedom to take or not take the calls.