handline knots

[sms082]

I am looking for the offical name for an becky knot. Can any one help? Actually I am trying to find out how to tie it again. I will appreat any help.

[loodvig]

Try looking here;
http://www.animatedknots.com/knotlist.php?LogoImage=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

[sms082]

another good spot- thanks. maby i can explain more? what i am looking for is the knot off your handline that goes around the pole. you can cintch it up to fit the pole.

[sms082]

and loodvig i will ask(weather i want to know or not) what makes an lineman think about an canndlelight dinner? is it the ark of making jumpers?

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

The best way I can explain it is to hold the rope with both hands. Twist the rope in opposite directions as to loosen the strands. Keep twisting until the strands roll back on themselves. This will create three loops in the rope. Push the end of the rope thru the three loops and you're done.

The placement on the rope of the three loops will be up to you. It will depend on the size poles you're working with.

The other end of the rope should have an eye splice connected to the hand line block.

[Pootnaigle]

I bleve this is called a becket and is purdy much standard on all handlines. Its purdy simple to make one, Jus roll the rope until 3 strands curl up, make sure and put em each in a half hitch and run the end thru all 3 of em. in the same direction as the eye splice on the handline block,, Its now a becket and adjustable. Most any Journeyman oughta be able to show ya this.

[sms082]

thanks for the info. just making sure i was correct, it has been about 7 years since i have done one. i am not wanting to teach anyone incorrectley!

[wtdoor67]

It was always my understanding that "Becky", referred to the complete piece of rope used, not the 3 loops etc. popped up to run the end of the rope through.

Like Poontangle says it always consists of 3 loops popped up, instead of the 2 shown in the photo.

To bind pieces of rope together, I've seen folks pop the three strands together and slip one end of rope through it. Holds okay for something temporary. Didn't call it a becky knot or anything for that matter.

For a hand line I came to prefer a guthook, without a becky at all. Like one guy I worked with said. I just hate a damn becky, always catching or hangin on something.

[Pootnaigle]

Ummmmm please fergive Door he kaint see . Itz purdy obvious that the photo shows three .....kourse he iz frum Oklahoma so it may be he kin see fine but kaint kount

[wtdoor67]

The middle loop was cammo.

Never noticed one made up in that fashion though. The slip loops don't seem right somehow either.

[Highplains Drifter]

For a hand line I came to prefer a guthook, without a becky at all. Like one guy I worked with said. I just hate a damn becky, always catching or hangin on something.


Amen...I prefer a 10 foot piece of rope and double wrap it on the pole using a square knot when I do not have a handy place to use the meat hook. The adjustable eye splice used on most beckets I have always called an Arkansas Eye Splice. The knot used on the end of a rope is a Crown Knot or Dog Turd not "Brown Trout"!!!:D

[jmorehouse24]

Amen...I prefer a 10 foot piece of rope and double wrap it on the pole using a square knot when I do not have a handy place to use the meat hook. The adjustable eye splice used on most beckets I have always called an Arkansas Eye Splice. The knot used on the end of a rope is a Crown Knot or Dog Turd not "Brown Trout"!!!:D

Amen is right, a head rope is a great way to go. Nothing like having to pound in a lag to hang your becky on, when you are on a bare pole. Or when you are at the comm level on a transmission pole and the damn becky wont fit around the pole.

[wudwlkr]

, but what concerns me is the use of that snap hook to attach the end of the loop to the handline block. Potentially putting up to a thousand pounds of pull on that rope (rating of most handline blocks) and trusting a cheap unrated snap hook to hold it? I always use a handline block that has an attached hook on top that is rated for the load that the loop from my becky can just snap into.

[Highplains Drifter]

and....I always up the becket one size from the handline, handline5/8""....becket 3/4" the becket is the weak part of the handline.

[Pootnaigle]

Ummmmm yep no handline I ever used incorporated such a cheap snap. Rather they had a load rated hook with a keeper snap incorporated into the handline block.As far as the length of the becket we had distribution handlines that would easily work a 50 pole and then we had transmission handlines that would work a 90( the beckets on them tend to be a lil bigger). . and then there were the tower lines we usta use a meathook on them but I bleve they told us they waz outlawed. The first handline blocks we used were wooden but incorporated no bearingsfor the shiv and then they were made of aluminum with bearings and now they are all plastic kause they wont make a flash

[Highplains Drifter]

Poot...shhhhhh...don't age yourself with wooden handline blocks...;)....you can still get a meat hook in aluminum or plastic and I have never seen a 404 block in plastic. What my peeve is when I see a hand line made up with a 4 to 5 inch eye splice and then 6 tucks and the ends are just taped and not tapered. That really tells me that those folks do not know how to work their job off of the wood. I teach a tapered eye splice with 3,4,and 5 tucks so one has the option of getting the eye splice into and through the hand line block.

[MI-Lineman]

Amen is right, a head rope is a great way to go. Nothing like having to pound in a lag to hang your becky on, when you are on a bare pole. Or when you are at the comm level on a transmission pole and the damn becky wont fit around the pole.

Huh? Can't remember ever havin mine slip!

There's a time and place for every tool! I use a "becky" on my handline and a "sling rope" or "head rope" for everything else! It's web slings I can't stand!:confused: Never the right length no matter how many damn wraps around ya give it. I use rope until the safety people come by then I got to hide it! Slowly becomin "illegal" like free climbin cause there's no weight rating tag!:eek:

Probably cause no knows how to tie knots anymore!!!:mad:

[jmorehouse24]

Huh? Can't remember ever havin mine slip!

There's a time and place for every tool! I use a "becky" on my handline and a "sling rope" or "head rope" for everything else! It's web slings I can't stand!:confused: Never the right length no matter how many damn wraps around ya give it. I use rope until the safety people come by then I got to hide it! Slowly becomin "illegal" like free climbin cause there's no weight rating tag!:eek:

Probably cause no knows how to tie knots anymore!!!:mad:

I am talking about when the pole is to fat to put your becky around. And check this out, the company I work for, has made the adjustable becky illegal. Why, I can't tell ya, but our becky's are a chunk of rope, with an eye splice and a snap in either end of the rope.

And i agree, good knots are becoming part of the past for some reason.

[climbsomemore]

MI Lineman said...There's a time and place for every tool! I use a "becky" on my handline and a "sling rope" or "head rope" for everything else! It's web slings I can't stand! Never the right length no matter how many damn wraps around ya give it. I use rope until the safety people come by then I got to hide it! Slowly becomin "illegal" like free climbin cause there's no weight rating tag!

Probably cause no knows how to tie knots anymore!!!

Yea... I asked a "journeyman" to tie a 404 at the base of a pole. We needed to direct a fall line in a certain direction so we could pull up a transformer.

I come back around... he has a rope sling tied up with some sort of bowline. the way he did it ended up with a single rope taking all the strain and the whole thing was loose as a goose ... just not what I wanted at all.

We took the rope and ran it around the pole twice and put a square knot against the back of the pole. Seems after 20 years in line work this cat could not tie a square knot.

What always confused me about this company... all the older line crew had been "tree trimmers" once upon a time. I thought arborists knew knots?
(Now that I have insulted the tree trade... these cats were not much as tree trimmers either)

[barehander]

You guys are a little off on what Sully was showing. We use the handline in that configuration to raise and lower tools, material (x-arms, insul., etc.) stuff like that, not for heavy rigging. The block is good for about 2000lbs, the 1/2 rope working load limit is 800lbs, the snap (Klien #470) is rated for 780lbs. The weakest link in Sullys setup is the handline hook, which is only rated at 250lbs. I have seen those hooks straighten out when it was hooked to a grip on 4/0 cu and drop the wire.

[Pootnaigle]

Yep bout the heaviest thang I kin member onna handline wuz a string of bells or a hook ladder. Once used one to get a downed static up high enough to get a hoist on it.We strung in a new span of wire and were using a capstan hoist to send it up but the capstan crapped out bout the same time the belly in the wire was bout 4 ft off the ground.It was apparent after the fact that the brass hook was trying to straighten out(long span between towers). A handline is for tools and stuff that one man can handle, It was never intended to change out timbers with.More than once I have added another handline block and made a set of 1-1 blocks to get sumpin heavy raised a tad.
one of our neighbors used a handline that had no hook just two eye splices with a sheetsbend innem..... worked fine.I bleve the advent of braided rope has deteriotated the skillset to make eye splices and backsplices. I sure see lottsa rope ends taped or knotted and ever once inna while whipped.
As far as slippin I have never seen a becket slip.Poles are purdy much tapered and if the becket is tightened and a screwdriver driven under it it aint goin nowhere.
I watch these apprentices fight handlines never realizing they kan be yer best friend or yer worst enemy.Position of the block is key. I've seen some otherwise talented folks work their butt off when proper rigging with that handline woudda saved em lottsa strainin n gruntin. Too many buckets n not enuff polewerk nowadays.

[MI-Lineman]

I am talking about when the pole is to fat to put your becky around. And check this out, the company I work for, has made the adjustable becky illegal. Why, I can't tell ya, but our becky's are a chunk of rope, with an eye splice and a snap in either end of the rope.

And i agree, good knots are becoming part of the past for some reason.

Probably for the same reason at our company! They can't figure how to put a weight rating tag on every inch of rope on the spool!!:rolleyes:

How about every crew gets their own spool of rope (WHICH HAS THE TAG OR STICKER ON IT) on their truck then there's no excuse for not knowing the load limits of your rope!:mad:

OH THAT'S RIGHT....THEY'RE WANTIN TO MAKE "IT SO EASY A CAVEMAN CAN DO IT!":eek:

[wtdoor67]

I've seen some otherwise talented folks work their butt off when proper rigging with that handline woudda saved em lottsa strainin n gruntin. Too many buckets n not enuff polewerk nowadays.



Non-riggers, I guess. I remember working with a high line "maintenance" crew once. Did some pole change outs. To facilitate removal of the old pole it was chain sawed down in pieces. Two men on the ground would let the piece down via a split hand line. It would be about all you could handle. Probably close to a 100 lbs. or better. They would gorilla it down with just the two of them letting it down.

Once it was my turn on the ground and I just took a couple of wraps on the truck hitch or something and let it down slowly and easily. I watched later to see if they would catch the ease of this method. Nope. Time again, they did it the hard way. Some people just like to do things the hard way I guess. These men were all fairly seasoned Journeymen, too.

I never made a comment.

Worked with a foreman once who always tied 2 pieces of rope together always by tying 2 intersecting bowlines. I used to do the same thing in his presence by simply using a sheet bend. Never saw him try this. I just concluded he didn't know how to make a sheet bend. Tough to do, huh?

[lewy]

Same thing when temporary dead ending wire seen JL use a bowline or sling instead of just putting 3 wraps & a half hitch, so much harder the other way to let the wire off.

[heelwinch]

I watch these apprentices fight handlines never realizing they kan be yer best friend or yer worst enemy.Position of the block is key. I've seen some otherwise talented folks work their butt off when proper rigging with that handline woudda saved em lottsa strainin n gruntin. Too many buckets n not enuff polewerk nowadays.

That's the mouthfull of the week right there.

If they had to do it off hooks or a tower, they'd know how to rig.


I honestly don't know how they get things done these days without breaking the bank.


Just let your jib line down and winch er up>>>>


God save this trade.

[MI-Lineman]

In Detroit we used hand lines even when we could get a truck to the pole! Up here had a guy with a jib have a chainsaw sent up on it!:confused: Could've came down, got a handling, tied it on the pole (providin he could tie a knot?:rolleyes:), and had one of us pull it to him twice in the same time it took just to lower the line?:o

[Liledgy]

Just because you pass some silly 2-3 week albat school doesn't make you a lineman. Even though some of these kids think they know something. The more they talk the more naive they sound, but what really gets me is when they bring up " I was an apprentice with him" , like we should treat you better than the next guy because you went to albat and another crew member didn't. Someone is building these pukes up! Now to be fair their are many apps that are modest and do their job, but the cockiness of the rest is realllllly irratating.

[jmorehouse24]

Probably for the same reason at our company! They can't figure how to put a weight rating tag on every inch of rope on the spool!!:rolleyes:

How about every crew gets their own spool of rope (WHICH HAS THE TAG OR STICKER ON IT) on their truck then there's no excuse for not knowing the load limits of your rope!:mad:

OH THAT'S RIGHT....THEY'RE WANTIN TO MAKE "IT SO EASY A CAVEMAN CAN DO IT!":eek:

They got rid of it before I hired on, but I am sure that is a very probable cause.

[Edge]

Becket on 'bustion.... headline on mission... same size rope for wood... size bigger for crete,steel or lattice...

I've said before... never really understood the hook... but after reading this thread and about how company actually ban rope and guys not knowing how to tie or rig... I can understand I reckon... I was brought up sorta like 'door in some ways always used a continuous handline that was joined with a sheetbend with a 3-6 foot tail...

only time I ever hand a hook was on lattice and it was a shepards hook... steel beaner on top steel beaner on the bottom... and sheperdhok inbetween... 5/8 samson rope...

think I was working for Davis H. when I saw that... great set up

for what it's worth...

Edge