2 killed in Oklahoma.

[wtdoor67]

Don't know any details. Just know it was a contractor working for OG&E near the community of Ravia. Soon as I get details I'll post them. They're being very mum about it.

[Highplains Drifter]

Dang I was hoping these reports would come to a halt through the Holidays. Let us know.

[cololinehand]

These are the same 2 guys I was talking about in the "Quiet Thread".

This is the email we received this morning:

The crew was working from a crane attached man-basket installing hard-line in preparation for a conductor pull on a double dead-end angle structure when it appears that a preform grip released causing the hard-line tension to release and catch the man-basket, tearing the man-basket from the crane. The man-basket fell approximately 100-feet to the ground fatally injuring the two men in the basket.



Memorial funds have been set up for the deceased's spouses by GSW employees, if you are interested in making a contribution I'm sure the families would be very grateful.



Jody McCarty Fundraiser Tyson Olsen Fundraiser

First Bank East Idaho Credit Union

Po Box 458 777 Shoup Street

Antlers, Ok 74523 Salmon, ID 83467

[topgroove]

How bizzare...have any of you guys ever used
a preform wrap to catch off the pulling rope... Why not simply let a little slack in the line, or catch it of both wats with a hoist.

[cololinehand]

Jody McCarty Fundraiser First Bank PO Box 458 Antlers. OK 74523

Tyson Olsen Fundraiser East Idaho Credit Union 777 Shoup Street Salmon, ID 83467

[wtdoor67]

That's gotta be it. Saw McCarty's obit in the paper. Just gave no details. Did list his occupation as Lineman. Only 26 years old. Too bad.

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

I guess I'd like a little more info on what was taking place. Was the hard line caught off the arm and they were attaching it to the sock? Was the hard line spans out and they were transferring the angle? Did the tail of the hard line wrap itself around the basket and tear it off the crane? Where exactly was the preform?

And yes, I have used a preform to catch hard line, one time in an emergency.

[topgroove]

I guess I'd like a little more info on what was taking place. Was the hard line caught off the arm and they were attaching it to the sock? Was the hard line spans out and they were transferring the angle? Did the tail of the hard line wrap itself around the basket and tear it off the crane? Where exactly was the preform?

And yes, I have used a preform to catch hard line, one time in an emergency.Sure in an emergancy with a little tension released using the preform may be risky, But in a case like this under full tension with all the time in the world.... Why on earth would one choose to use something that was never designed or engeneered for that purpose?

I can honestly say the thought of using a preform
for such a use would never cross my mind.

[Highplains Drifter]

May they RIP. No one has established it was the end of the hard line that took out the basket. Maybe they were working in the bite. Either the end of the line or bite working in the dumb side makes more since. High line hard lines is unlike most winch lines people deal with. Hard line is made up of 3, 5 or 7 individual wedge's of mulitstrands of steel. Hard line, last I knew was true 3/8 5/8 and 7/16 not the millimeters that today’s guys come in. I would never put a strain on a preform holding a hard line.

[US & CA Tramp]

Great South West management knows better than to allow this. They have been talked to several times in the past about not using preforms as grips on the hard line and old copper conductor being removed under tension!!!

[reppy007]

Wrote a post titled the next,theres always going to be the next guy.This is extremly sad,guys might have been married,maybe had children.Just going to work to provide for his family,getting caught up in an accident which takes his life.Not too much of a merry x-mas for some people.Knowing that this might have taken place in a split second bothers me,thats how long it takes to lose a life.Extremly sad is all ill say.

[topgroove]

we have the same problem here. I bet every utility is the same. They hire these contractors without having a clue about actual workers. We've had workers fired , Drug & alchohol problems, Only to see them months later on a contracted job. I bet that guy used that preform trick all the time and nothing ever went wrong untill that tragic day.

[bren guzzi]

You guys can shoot me down in flames if you like. BUT every week on this forum you are loosing a linesman WTF...... Are you guys playing at. ?????? Don't give me the BS about union / non union. Etc .. That *****ings gotta stop..... You are killing young men every week AND ITS GOTTA stop...... I been doing this job over 30 years ..... So I've a bit of experience... We had these problems "years ago" the way round it is UNITY !!!!! We had union / non union etc and plenty of deaths... What we did was started a linesmans asociation that wasn't affiliated to any union or company.. It was by lines men for linesmen.... Any one with a problem could have it addresed . I know you've a massive country so you could do it on a state by state basis. And as for your rodeos... Forget about them ......... I work on the principal that you go up a pole as least times as possible and spend as little time up there as possible. I plan it so we have all the gear ready for the guys befoer they go up .... You've guys at rodeos running up poles as quick as posible doing things as quick as they can..... WHAT FOR.... I WOULD RESPECT YOU MORE IF WHEN ASKED TO CLIMB A POLE IF THEY SAID NO !!!!!!!! Wtf are you doing racing .... I'm ANGRY AT THESE DEATHS... And angry at the fact that nothing seems to be happening over there to change the way "its always been done". Dunno who said it but its never been truer..... Divide and conquer..... WE ARE ALL LINEMEN not line *****s.... Unite unite unite..... Its not good enough. Shame on us all for letting it happen.... Let's use this forum to help stop these deaths.. I'm pissed off.. I don't care if they were using preforms in corectly or not neither do I suspect their familys and loved ones do. We have another family that will dread the very mention of christmas from now on.. Grow some balls and use them...... If I can help in anyway just ask.. I will come to the states at my own expense and go into any uttility and , chain myself to their gates if I have to . USE THE PRESS .. And the internet ANYTHING to make non line people aware that these companys are killing your young men.....

RIP "again". :(

[topgroove]

well said, well spoken Bren... you've summed it up prefectly! I've been venting for years about this. Seams these accidents will never stop and only gets worse everyday. The corporate motto these days is greed is good. Profit seams to be the only motavating factor.

Contractors trip over themselves trying to underbid eachother. The workers seam to be the cowboy, get-er-done redneck hillbillies who have three teath in their head.

We've been losing expierence in the trade for years through retirement and its being replaced by young kids. Sure they're hard working young kids, but their being trained by guys with questionable safety habbits.


Whenever a fatality happens the first thing the suits do is hush it up. the legal team springs into action and an investigation gets underway..... funny thing is we never get to hear the real story. its alyways some carefully construed story that shifts the blame on the dead guy everytime.

Unfortunatly we are a country devided. There is no sence of brotherhood that you are so used to in Ireland. Over here its a me, me mentality. Whats good for me is good, Fu(k the rest. I've got mine, screw you seams to be the flavor of the day.

Some day body-bags will be a storeroom item. We'll all carry a few in the side box.

[bren guzzi]

We got together in ireland and joined forces to make change happen. It took a lot of time an effort.aand still does...... But we changed what was wrong.... We joined with linesmen in the uk and kept annoying our respective companys. It didn't matter if you were union , non union or contractor. You had an equal say....... We all benifited by sticking together. I FEEL YOU GUYS ARE BEING BULLIED. And real men shoudnt put up with bullies. If you do ya deserve all ya get I'm afraid. :(

[topgroove]

Slaves lose everything in their chains, even the desire of escaping from them.
[/URL]
[URL="http://www.powerlineman.com/citasautor.asp?autor=16288"]Jean Jacques Rousseau (http://www.powerlineman.com/enviar_frase.asp?id=32687) (1712-1778) Swiss political philosopher and essayist.

[Pootnaigle]

Ummmmmmmmm Bren I have a newfound respect fer you. I are afraid me n yew see thangs kinda alike.

[bren guzzi]

Thank you kindly........... I was afraid my views would be met with derision . But so far so good. As ya know .. I'm a bit of a joker and a bit flippent at times... BUT this issue really gets me angry. I've been through it years ago and its so bloody obvious to ME ,,,, it wasn't easy.... Don't think it was.. We endured hardships , strikes, threats but we stuck together..... And now all companys are pretty much saftey orientated.. The company I'm with now. Scotish an Southern . Have a motto... If it can't be done safely it can't be done. And they really want to be " the safest utility in the world". And trust me they still make a lot of money. So it can be done.... Its like being involved with the introduction of compulsary seat belt wearing and wathcing your fellow workers driving around having there seat belts cut as they drive out of the yard by their bosses. ITS WRONG.....

I'm ready for any abuse as well...... Bring it on..... :)

[BigClive]

The thing is... The high number of deaths in the dawn of the industry was EXACTLY why the IBEW (International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers) was created, but it's gone rancid and seriously needs replaced. But first they need to deal with the legal companies that exist to destroy and prevent unions. Those "lawyers" are responsible for the deaths of American workers and should be put to death. They should then prepare the electric chair for the profiteering corporate management that sacrifice life for profit, then move onto the contractors that murder youngsters by pushing them beyond their ability.

America has gone rotten, and it's being copied here in the UK.

[topgroove]

Yep corporate America is rotten to the core, Most Americans are clueless of the situation

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Bren, I agree with alot of what you're saying and I think it's great that you guys all came together over there. But, I'm afraid that outcome in the states is like a Unicorn. It doesn't exist and no matter how much you wish it did, it never will. Now I never said it can't, I just firmly believe it won't.

I am a Union Lineman. I've never worked non-union and I've never looked down on anybody who has or does. Some of my best friends are non-union lineman who work very safe and are hard workers. In the end, a man is a man trying to provide for his family, union or not. I mentioned above that I am union. But, over the last few years of reading some things on here and having to work with some guys in the field, I cant say that I'm a proud union member. I am, however, very proud of what I do. I take pride in what I do, in everything I do.

As to the idea of all linemen in the states joining as one, have you seen how union members treat each other on here? Do you think their mindset is any different on the job? Now factor in the idea of having to hold hands with a non-union guy. Someone above hit the nail on the head when they posted the majority mentality of, "As long as I got mine, f•ck the rest of you!". That will never go away.

[bren guzzi]

I'm addressing this to every one that reads this. You all admit that you've a problem . And you can pretend it can't be fixed because of so many historical factors and company policies. That's BULL ... You have the power to chnge things. All ya need is the willpower and Quite frankly the balls. Stop seeing the negatives ....... I will leave ya with this famous saying. And you can blame everyone else for the situation...........



FOR EVIL TO FLORISH ALL IT TAKES IS FOR GOOD MEN TO DO NOTHING.......

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Huh, I guess I didn't realize it was that easy. Since you've got it all figured out, pack your bags and come on over. I really want to see how far you get.

[topgroove]

I bet Bren never met a redneck, nascar lovin hill-billy yet.


Bren You have no idea.... these guys go to family re-unions just to pick up chicks. there family tree looks like a utility pole for christ sake. The land of men are men and sheep are scared sort of thing.

Aliens in UFO's dont even come here anymore ever since some redneck hillbilly tried to have sex with their garbage disposal.

[bren guzzi]

Huh, I guess I didn't realize it was that easy. Since you've got it all figured out, pack your bags and come on over. I really want to see how far you get.


You've all got it figured....... I'm angry that you put up with it... I've BEEN THERE.... It took real hardship to achieve what we got..... I personally was on strike for oveer 3 months , getting only strike pay " a pittence" and I wasn't striking for me I was striking along side every linesman in ireland at the time........ We were ridiculed in the press but eventually we got public oppinion on our side because we were not striking for more money ... We had had enough of being bullied. Being forced into working without proper training, guys getting killed regularly, his family getting minimum compensation because he had sighned a bull S..t contract. , different procedures for doing the same job.... Wanting everything done live "to not inconvenience the customer" RING ANY BELLS.....? . Now you can get mad at me if ya like. But I don't work like that anymore and neither do my company..... If they did I would walk away....... If ya want me to come over as I said I will do..... I'm not afraid to fight battles. I didn't sort anything out over here on my own. WE DID IT TOGETHER... And while you guys are squabbling amongst yourselves nothing will change FACT ! We didn't have forums like this back then .... If we did it would be easier...... LET ME MAKE IT SIMPLE FOR YOU...... STEP 1 boycot every rodeo. Won't cost ya anything but if every lineman in the States refused to attend , what message would that send out to the people running the " games". And the sponsors etc etc...... Or maybe stand outside a rodeo. With a little banner " WE LOSE ON AVERAGE ONE LINEMAN A WEEK.... It aint rocket science.

[Highplains Drifter]

I heard more about this last Friday and I have been waiting for someone to respond. I did a search and I can not find anything. Two young men 21 and 22 moving the hard line from a Skookum to the dolly. They fastened one side of the hard line to their man basket not knowing that booms are not rated for side strain.. It actually severed the one man in half.

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Prime example of why they are pushing so hard to get certified crane operators.

[Highplains Drifter]

Prime example of why they are pushing so hard to get certified crane operators.


I think most or that is so the Operating Engineers do not get into line work. I looked at their ages and my first thought was lots of inexperience and if one looks at the mechanics of a crane you can see they are not made for side strain. My bet is the two young men came out of one of those climbing schools, they are an unlimited supply of cheap man power for certain types of contractors. The whole thing is such a terrible tragedy that should have never happened with the proper teachings.

[topgroove]

I think most or that is so the Operating Engineers do not get into line work. I looked at their ages and my first thought was lots of inexperience and if one looks at the mechanics of a crane you can see they are not made for side strain. My bet is the two young men came out of one of those climbing schools, they are an unlimited supply of cheap man power for certain types of contractors. The whole thing is such a terrible tragedy that should have never happened with the proper teachings.
Your dead-on brother! what a senceless tragedy! I noticed how young they were also. 2011 has got to be a fatality record. We've had at least one fatality every week. Most of the dead are younger than 25 years old. We read these accidents and scratch our heads thinking WTF! How on earth can a company take some kid fresh out of some climbing school and send him to there death. Seriously... how do they live with themselves? How can they possibly sleep at night?


Could you imagine the horror the other crew members expierenced seeing their co-worker cut in half not to mention the other young man falling 100 feet to his death!

What were the workers on the ground thinking when they saw the workers in the basket attach the hardline to the basket?

[cololinehand]

We are having a safety stand down tomorrow morning and whatever info they pass along I will do the same.

I haven't heard of either the side strain or the severed body. They were 22 and 26 from what I have been told.

[Highplains Drifter]

We are having a safety stand down tomorrow morning and whatever info they pass along I will do the same.

I haven't heard of either the side strain or the severed body. They were 22 and 26 from what I have been told.

Please do!

[reppy007]

Im trying to stay low on this accident,I wont really get into this one yet.What i will say, is about all accidents.There are different types of accidents,studies show that 90% of them are caused by human error,thats a high number.The most highest is vehicles.Maybe we need to put more emphasis on prevention,we can talk about any accident,all day or all year long,but by that time its already done,the point of no return.Id argue that prevention is the best tool that we have,plain and simple.Yes the young guys need more training,yes they are putting inexperienced guys in situations that they shouldnt be in.We always look at the workers involved,where is the supervision?Are they on the ground talking on their cell phones while inexperienced guys are working in the air,or maybe they are on the ground day-dreaming.All these accidents have one thing in common,and that is they happen in a split seconds and once started theres no control,nothing you can do,thats called the point of no return.All we have is that tool called prevention,like any tool it has to be used right.At each tailboard,we need to take a closer look at what can go wrong,not at what will go right.Doing things right doesnt injure anyone.I was brought up thinking that hazards are to be pointed out at tailboards.I was also brought up at a time where there were plenty of people and where the headlineman was constantly watching what went on in the air.Did any of that happen on this accident?We need to take a closer look at what we are doing wrong,maybe we have gotten away from the easiest tool we know,prevention.Lineman dont need a company to tell us what is wrong,let me rephrase that(good lineman).At this point i dont even care who gets involved,the companies,the contractors,union or non union,even the international,they seem to do a fairly good job at being silent.But come on guys,we all know its prevention,theres simply no other tool to be effective.That includes training,maybe lots more training.

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

I think most or that is so the Operating Engineers do not get into line work. I looked at their ages and my first thought was lots of inexperience and if one looks at the mechanics of a crane you can see they are not made for side strain. My bet is the two young men came out of one of those climbing schools, they are an unlimited supply of cheap man power for certain types of contractors. The whole thing is such a terrible tragedy that should have never happened with the proper teachings.


My comment was aimed towards the guy running the crane. This can be blamed on inexperience all day, but in the end who's really at fault? Who put two inexperienced guys in the air? And why? I have strong opinions about line schools, but that's for a different thread.

[topgroove]

My comment was aimed towards the guy running the crane. This can be blamed on inexperience all day, but in the end who's really at fault? Who put two inexperienced guys in the air? And why? I have strong opinions about line schools, but that's for a different thread.

You put to in-experienced guys in the air like that and alow them to pull that stunt, What does that tell you about the guy running the crane. Not only that... How bout the foreman of the job. You could go right up the chain of comand. We've seen this movie before, Even read the book. In the end, blame will be placed on the dead guys, Happens everytime. Nothing ever changes. To much money on the table. In the end isn't it always about the money.

[wantafastz28]

Just out of curiosity... would something like this cause the rest of the crew to get fired? Or just a slap on the wrist?

[topgroove]

OMG... where I work that contractor would never be allowed on the property ever!
They would lose that contract and any others withen hours!

[lrawlins]

Hi,

On December 11th I got a text message from one of my sisters to call her ASAP.

I immediately called and was told one of her grandsons had been killed working as a lineman in Oklahoma. Tyson S Olson was only 22 years old and had just recently moved to Oklahoma.

I searched in vain for any information on what happened and this is the ONLY place I that even mentioned the tragedy.

Not only are there two grieving young widows, but what about the coworkers who witnessed it? I doubt they would be so hardened with life not to suffer from the trauma of seeing this unfold before their eyes.

I want to sincerely offer my thanks for the information posted here that explains what happened to a family member.

Bye for now,

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

You put to in-experienced guys in the air like that and alow them to pull that stunt, What does that tell you about the guy running the crane. Not only that... How bout the foreman of the job. You could go right up the chain of comand. We've seen this movie before, Even read the book. In the end, blame will be placed on the dead guys, Happens everytime. Nothing ever changes. To much money on the table. In the end isn't it always about the money.

Just what I was getting at. Things like this don't just happen with contractors, it also happens at utilities. Take a look at Georgia Powers accident resume, it's not good.

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Hi,

On December 11th I got a text message from one of my sisters to call her ASAP.

I immediately called and was told one of her grandsons had been killed working as a lineman in Oklahoma. Tyson S Olson was only 22 years old and had just recently moved to Oklahoma.

I searched in vain for any information on what happened and this is the ONLY place I that even mentioned the tragedy.

Not only are there two grieving young widows, but what about the coworkers who witnessed it? I doubt they would be so hardened with life not to suffer from the trauma of seeing this unfold before their eyes.

I want to sincerely offer my thanks for the information posted here that explains what happened to a family member.

Bye for now,

I'm sorry for your loss and I'm sorry you had to find out here. I'm also sorry that some comments seem pretty harsh, but know that they are not pointed at the two dead guys. It's not their fault if they're inexperienced and put into a situation like that. Accidents like this should and need to go straight to the top, but unfortunately they don't. Again, I'm very sorry for your loss.

[topgroove]

Just what I was getting at. Things like this don't just happen with contractors, it also happens at utilities. Take a look at Georgia Powers accident resume, it's not good. I whole heartedly agree... There's a ton of ratty Utilities out there too! your absoutly right its not just contractors.

[bren guzzi]

I saw the post from the person that got the txt.... VERY SORRY FOR YOUR LOSS. All on here areas well I'm sure... Reminds me that we've gotta be careful what we say on here due the fact that we've no control over who is reading our posts. And I include "laywers and people that are hireing an fireing...... So pesonally will try an keep that in mind.
"Inrormation is power" an they have enough of that already" SADLY. :(

[BigClive]

Sadly Powerlineman has been trawled by lawyers in the past and they're likely to lap up all the "opinions" posted in response to accident reports no matter how misinformed and speculative they may be. No matter how an accident happens, there's always an "expert" who would have done it "right" and tries to show their "expertise" by implying that the victim/s of an accident were wrong to do things a particular way.

Since they rarely know the true details of the accident, it's all valueless speculative gossip.

[topgroove]

No worries Clive... The company involved has done a fine job covering up the whole mess. No one will be fined. No one will lose there job. Hell, in a little while no-one will even remember the two young men, except of cource the grieving widows and family. For them the pain lives on forever. Sure feelings of sorrow grow numb. but the pain will never go away. By next month we'll be reading about another senceless tradgedy and this will be a meer footnote in the arcives.

RIP brothers.

[climbsomemore]

but it does lack experience.

GF's take advantage of that. Union or not. Give a kid who's been topped out 2 years a take home crew cab, pay his per diem and give him a crew. Why? He may not be a redneck... but he just wont have the people skills, or any other attribute to lead men. The GF will push the kid to push his crew to make units or whatever.... and the kid will run himself and everyone else to death to look like he's a leader.

Last transmission job I was on... most days we had 3 to 5 guys on that crew. Foreman was 26, his wingman ... the same (plus they were high school buddies). Now and then we got an apprentice. I was generally on that crew. (way over 40) the other guy we had somedays was way over 50 with a LOT of steel transmission experience.

The 2 kids... lot's of grab ass.... lot's of hustle (especially when the GF was down the lead prowling-cell phones are great) lot's of texting and personal business. I'd get griped at for not being in the air ... these two kids were learning on the job.

We were clipping a few days... those big old travelers would come down so the other crews could use them in the next section. A bunch were cracked. Why? Kiddo would toss em into a beet feild from 80 feet up. Too slow to use a handline much less load em up and bring em down in the basket.

We were setting pole bases ... the kids ran the backhoe, the old guys got to drive the dump truck and shovels . Until the boss shows up.

One day I got really tired of the GF telling me I had to "teach more". I told him he put that kid up front...he could deal with it.
The kid didnt want us to ground on clip in... did not know how to ground tensioners or pulling rigs when we worked those jobs either.

But you know... he was not shy about telling me how old, tired, slow, and out of date I was.

Best one yet.
This job had a set of 138kV airbrakes about 90 feet up a pair of wooden poles. During the week another day care crew got the wire off and glass down. We were working Saturdays...and got to take the actuall switch and platform down. The other guys had moved all the man-cranes and track buckets down to another section. We were climbing this.

Sat morning...."got your tools? we have a climber today"...Yep good to go.

Get out there. We did have a off road crane and operator waiting for a tail board.

CO...whats the plan?
Kid...I dunno what do you think
CO... what you have for rigging?
Kid...(comes out with some yellow bellies -looks at CO for validation)
Of course I am behing the Kid... and the CO is lauging his ass off.

"what do think old timer?"
I think the Kid is my boss?
But I'd use those 4 big endless slings and grab this platform at all four corners...take a strain... drift the bolts out and let you fly it down. that thing has to weigh .... what? 2500 pounds?

"Kid"- uhhhh OK

So me and the ape (fresh of a distribution rotation) climb up to the platform. I talk the ape out ... and we set the rigging on the corners... then I brought all of to the hook in the center. This ape was a good kid... but he had never been to the top of a 50 outside of school yet.

We both took a pole worked down and started beatin 7/8" bolts ...of course they were bent. We beat on them for about 2 hours.

After lunch... a bucket shows up and wonder KID and his Wingman fly up and cut the dang poles with a chainsaw.

Of course that came up in the tailboard... but they were convinced they needed to recover those poles intact.

I got chewed out for not cutting those poles earlier. They were a little offended when I drug that job early.

[cololinehand]

At our stand down we were told what happened. I am going to relate it to you as it was told to us and that is without opinion or judgement.

For this explanation we are going to say the wire was being pulled in from the RIGHT and the puller was positioned to the LEFT around a 70 degree corner.

For starters the structure was a 3 pole structure in a wooded area of OK where they had been working 7 days a week.

The puller had been set up on an angle to the pole because only enough ROW had been purchased for the line. There was not any extra purchased to accomodate the puller in a straight line.

The pull was made(12000') coming from the RIGHT. When the conductor neared the pole the pull was stopped to enable the crew to raise the traveler up higher on the pole closer to the final attachment point.

A sand strand, fanner, preform was wrapped around the 3/4" hardline running to the RIGHT and slack was let into the hardline from the puller to the LEFT. The traveler was removed to be repositioned. The hardline began running through the preform to the RIGHT and came tight ripping from the looped end of the preform toward the end facing to the RIGHT. Basically the hardline tried to straighten itself out from the puller to the sock. Unfortunately the 2 linehands(a 1st step app and a lineman were in the bite and the basket was torn off sending everything to the ground.

I hope I have explained this in a clear enough manner leaving out my opinions of what went wrong and some other minute details, that given the open forum(read this as relatives) really don't need to see/read.

If you feel the need to armchair QB this please keep in mind those who have lost husbands, brothers, sons, or uncles that may read your words.

We all need to realize that we are ALL in a dangerous profession and it doesn't care if we are union of not, been in the trade 10 years or all our adult life, have the best training or none at all.

Please be safe out there and especially this time of year when your mind may wander about the time you are taking off, the friends and family you are going to spend time with or the great present you bought that special someone.

C

[topgroove]

Thanks Co. very clear explaination. I got to ask the question though... Is it standard practice to use a preform to catch off the hardline?

[cololinehand]

From what I have been told and experienced grips do not grip the steel, they tend to slide.

When I was a young ape we used preforms to pull out the static and pull in a fiber encased static. We used preforms to join the double dead ends(taping the ends to prevent them from being forced open going through the travelers).

I do know that preforms are only good for a certain number of uses as the "sand" gets rubbed out of them.


C

[topgroove]

We still use preforms to pull in static... Catching off a hardline on a 12,000 foot pull? I don't think so.

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Regular grips will not work on their own on hardline. They make wedge grips specifically for hard lines, but companies are too cheap to supply them.

[dogman]

I live in NW Oklahoma, I'm wondering why there is no media coverage of this accident. I get all the tv stations out of OKC.

[reppy007]

I live in NW Oklahoma, I'm wondering why there is no media coverage of this accident. I get all the tv stations out of OKC.

I live in houston,never do hear of that happening either,all our news is about murders,vehicle accidents where someone is killed,and about our local professional sport teams,which arent even contenders most times.We also hear about the inportant news that all of you hear,you know stories about the Royal family,Charlie Sheen,Linsey Slowhand,Mr Chaz Bono,Jennifer Aniston and so on.Can you imagine what the newscasters would say about a accident about linework,they would be so confused explaining the materials that we work around.Even here ,it can be difficult to fully understand the facts about the accidents.Sometimes they seem to never report on the big powerful utilities,especially when it involves an accident,wonder why?

[topgroove]

I live in houston,never do hear of that happening either,all our news is about murders,vehicle accidents where someone is killed,and about our local professional sport teams,which arent even contenders most times.We also hear about the inportant news that all of you hear,you know stories about the Royal family,Charlie Sheen,Linsey Slowhand,Mr Chaz Bono,Jennifer Aniston and so on.Can you imagine what the newscasters would say about a accident about linework,they would be so confused explaining the materials that we work around.Even here ,it can be difficult to fully understand the facts about the accidents.Sometimes they seem to never report on the big powerful utilities,especially when it involves an accident,wonder why?

Well Reppy, its kinda a long story but...
In the early years of our democracy the "free press" was all that stood between greedy corporate interests, government corruption and you and I. While many newspapers were controlled by wealthy individuals such as William Randolph Hearst, who influenced the content of the news in his papers, a kind of journalistic "Hippocratic oath" seemed to prevail across the country as reporters and publishers at small papers usually chose to pursue the truth in reporting.

Local papers, TV stations and radio outlets were owned mostly by local individuals with an interest in their community. That began to change as a powerful institution known as the Council On Foreign Relations gained power and the trend toward total corporate media control rapidly accelerated during the Bush era with media consolidation.

Suddenly the old rule that one corporation could not own all of the town's news outlets was gone. Companies like Clear Channel Communications suddenly began to buy up every radio station, TV outlet and newspaper in major markets, effectively controlling everything that people read, watched and heard. The pattern of media consolidation has increased during the last eight years to the point that now only a few corporations control the news that we watch.

Just like the quote above, he who owns the media, controls the media. With such powerful platforms they are able to drown out independent media and control public opinion and government policy. There can be no freedom without freedom of the press and there can be no freedom of the press if only a few powerful corporations are allowed to own it.

[reppy007]

Spelled it backwords,fox news shows that well,whatever the owner likes ,everyone that works there likes.Just like an apprentice once said in a verbal evaluation from a supervisor,when taking his final verbal exam for Jy.Supervisor asked him if he liked football,apprentice comes back with this,(IF YOU LIKE FOOTBALL,I LIKE FOOTBALL)then the supervisor asked him if he was a team player.He replies,throw me the ball and ill run with it.

[Pootnaigle]

Ummmmmmmm add to that that the major utilities in every locality spend mega bucks on advertising both in the printed media and the broadcast media.Nobody wants to anger them by publishing sumpin that puts em inna bad light.so they adhere to the thang My Mammy usta tell me
" if'n ya kaint say nuffin good bout sumbody dont say nuffin at all".

[graybeard]

I haven't been on for awhile and when I do the first thread I go to is the safety thread. Maybe they should change it to the bad news thread. What I've noticed is that over the years management has been the biggest change in the industry. Used to be that those who were in top management were engineers who came up through the company. Thats not the case anymore. They are now all bean counters and lawyers only focused on profit. As a result safety suffers because its become a money issue. For some reason they seem to be willing to spend all kinds of money, but only to meet the min. OSHA regs. Safety starts at the top and when its just talk because they really don't have a clue about how the work gets done safety is just a saying. When it comes to man power, equipment and other issues then theres no money or time.
The best thing we can do for starters is to watch out for each other. We can't let an employeers greed for biger profits get us injured or killed.

[reppy007]

All in all everything said,is true,but thats alot of tension for a preform,how much longer would it have taken to use a hoist and grip,even in most emergencies,the damage might be done anyway.

[jrlinetrash]

I worked side by side with these two for awhile now. Both of them were great lineman and great friends. It was a horrible thing that happened that day and will be missed by all of us at gsw. Rest in peace brothers.

[topgroove]

I worked side by side with these two for awhile now. Both of them were great lineman and great friends. It was a horrible thing that happened that day and will be missed by all of us at gsw. Rest in peace brothers.

Rest in peace brothers!

Promise us one thing jrlinetrash... never ever under any circumstance shall a preform ever be used to hold a hardline under tension.

[cololinehand]

Unless Im mistaken, the preform was the correct size but it was the SIDE strain from the opposite end(eye end) of preform that caused the catastrophic failure.

C

[55lineman]

while i was not there nor did i see what happened, I can only write about things i know. In our trade experience is getting thinner. many of our foreman are 20 something years old with less than a year as a lineman. Very few travel around and get time in their tools. the result...... a downhill spiral. Our next generation of lineman are being trained by foremans with little or no actual line work experience. and it is easy to tell somebody to do something you never did yourself. What is to follow i believe is more accidents. While some of these young guys are very smart, the innevitably will get put in over their heads, and most are afraid to say "i dont know how to do this yet" for fear of losing their pickup. Very frustrating to watch this as more accidents are sure to follow. My advise..... do yourself and your brothers a favor when asked to take a crew while your ink is still wet on your ticket.....respectfully decline and tell them you need more training as a lineman out of respect for our trade

[birdhunter]

FELLOW BROTHERS FRIENDS AND COWOKERS I AM WRITING THIS IN REGAURDS TO A PHONE CALL I RECIEVED ON DECEMBER 11- 2011 AT ABOUT 10-30 AM. THE CALL WAS FROM MY OLDEST SON TELLING ME THAT HIS BEST FRIEND/MOTERCYCLE BUDDY/HUNTING COMPANION/ONLY BROTHER HAD BEEN KILLED IN A HORRIBLE MANNER. I WAS JUST CMPLETELY FLOORED TO THINK THAT SUCH AN EVENT COULD EVAN HAPPEN. I HAVE SPENT THE LAST SEVENTY DAYS HOPING THE BAD DREAM WOULD END BUT IT HASNT AND I DOUBT IT EVER WILL. BEING AT LEAST A TWO DAY DRIVE TO OKLAHOMA TO TRY TO HELP MY OLDEST SON SAID HE THOUGHT HE COULD MAKE THE ARRANGEMENTS TO GET HIS BROTHER HOME.I CANNOT EVAN IMAGINE THE STRENGHT IT WOULD TAKE TO NOT ONLY BE AT THAT JOBSITE BUT TO WITTNESS YOUR BEST FRIEND AND BROTHER FALL OVER ONE HUNDRED FEET TO HIS DEATH. SINCE DECEMBER 11-2011 I HAVE NOT HEARD ONE REASON FOR THIS ACCIDENT OTHER THAN YOUR KIND POSTS ON THIS FORUM AND I THANK YOU. OUR FAMILY SENT GSC A VERY TALENTED SMART HARD WORKING YOUNG MAN TO HELP THEM AND SO HE COULD START HIS NEW LIFE AND FAMILY. THEY SENT US A BODY BAG WITH NO THANK YOU NO **** YOU OR ANYTHING JUST ALOT OF YYYYYYYs ? I HONESTLY DO NOT KNOW HOW MUCH LINEMAN OR SAFTY TRAINING WAS GIVEN I ONLY KNOW THAT TYSON HAD ONLY BEEN IN THE TRADE FOR ABOUT NINETY DAYS AND HAD WORKED TWELVE TO SIXTEEN HOURS A DAY FOR THAT PERIOD OF TIME WITH ONLY TWO PARTIAL DAYS OFF DUE TO RAIN DELAYS. TYSON WAS THE MOST DECORATED WRESTLER IN SALMON IDAHOS HIGH SCHOOL TEAM WITH HIS BROTHER NOT FAR BEHIND SO THE HARD WORK IS NOTHING. IF YOVE NEVER PULLED WIRE AT OVER ONE HUNDRED FEET IN THE AIR HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THE RIGHT OR WRONG WAY TO DO THIS HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THAT THE COMPANY DID NOT PURCHASE ENOUGH RIGHT AWAY TO DO THE JOB SAFELY HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THAT THIS THING THEY CALL A PREFORM WAS NOT THE TOOL OF CHOICE.YOU WOULD HOPE THAT YOUR COMPANY HAD THE RIGHT PEOPLE THAT KNEW HOW TO KEEP YOU SAFE. I WAS TOLD THAT THERE WERE THREE SAFTY MEN CLOSE ENOUGH TO SEE THIS ROLLER COASTER RIDE UNFOLD. DO THESE SAFTEY MEN KNOW ANYTHING AT ALL ABOUT PULLING WIRE OR ARE THEY JUST THERE BECAUSE WALL MART DOESNT NEED ANY GREETERS. (AGAIN I DONT REALLY KNOW) I ALSO DONT KNOW FOR SURE IF THEY TRIED TO PULL THIS WIRE WITH THERE BUCKET TRUCK BUT IF THEY DID MABEY ONE OF THESE SAFTY GUYS COULD HAVE STOPPED SUCH FOOLISHNESS (again i dont know because the truth has not been told) I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO SPEAK PERSONNALLY WITH ONE OR MORE OF YOU EXPERIENCED LINEMAN THAT MIGHT HAVE BEEN THERE BECAUSE THESE YOUNG MEN ARE NOT DISSPOSIBLE LIKE A TAMPOON THEY ARE SOMEBODIES BROTHER SON FRIEND COMPANION AND A PROVIDER FOR THERE FAMILY.WITHOUT PROPER INSTRUCTION FROM THER MANAGEMENT SUPERVISERS COWORKERS A HORRIBLE DEATH WILL ALWAYS BE THE FINAL OUT COME. TYSON DID NOT GO TO OKLAHOMA TO SACRAFICE HIS LIFE FOR A POWER LINE THAT HE WOULD NEVER USE. BUT HE DID MAKE THE ULTAMATE SACRIFICE BECAUSE OF PEOPLE THAT CHOOSE TO BE UNSAFE/TAKE SHORTCUTS/SAFE A LITTLE TIME/MAKE BIG PROFITS AND DONT SEEM TO CARE ABOUT HUMAN LIFE. FOR ALOT OF PEOPLE THIS IS OLD NEWS BUT FOR TYSON FAMILY NOT A MOMENT GOES BY THAT HE DOESNT CONSUME OR HEART AND MINDS OVER A SENCELESS TRAGIDY. IF ANY OF YOU WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK WITH ME I CAN BE REACHED AT 208-881-1798 OR olsenstephen43@yahoo.com THANK YOU FOR YOUR POSTS ON THIS FORUM AND I WOULD LOVE TO HEAR FROM ALL OF YOU AGAIN ALSO WANT TO THANK THOSE WHO TRAVELED ALL THE WAY TO IDAHO FOR TYSON FUNERAL IT SHOWED ME THE GREAT RESPECT YOU HAD FOR TYSON AND IM SURE HE HAD THE SAME FOR YOU.ITS GOING TO TAKE THAT SAME BROTHERHOOD TO PREVENT THESE MURDERS FROM HAPPENING.YOU LINEMAN ARE GOING TO HAVE TO GET CONTROLL OF YOUR TRADE AND CALL BULL**** WHEN YOUR EXPERIENCE AND KNOWLEGE WILL SAVE YOUR LIFE STEPHEN OLSEN